RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage

NTDEV
21

Looks like that’s why MS uses FireWire for WinDbg.

BTW - can I put breakpoints to OHCI1394.SYS while running debugger via
FireWire? :-))))

I expect OHCI1394 to expose some simple hooks (like dump pointers in
storage stack) for KD to use. Am I right?

Max

----- Original Message -----
From: “Moreira, Alberto”
To: “NT Developers Interest List”
Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 6:20 PM
Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage

> I wonder if anyone has used Firewire yet ? One of the problems in
such a
> setup can be I/O bandwidth, and Firewire is great for that.
>
> Alberto.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Maxim S. Shatskih [mailto:xxxxx@storagecraft.com]
> Sent: Sunday, October 13, 2002 6:18 PM
> To: NT Developers Interest List
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
>
> > > Logic analyzer people also sell software that converts a PC
> running Windows
> > > into a logic analyzer. You connect the cable to some I/O port,
and
> presto, a
> > > PC can be the diagnostic tool for another PC. In fact, you can
> even homebrew
> > > a logic analyzer, it’s not that outrageous a proposition.
> >
> > I’d love to hear some more detail on this.
>
> A custom board which plugs to the logic it must analyze :-), and
> having a serial port on it. Then connect it to a PC and run some PC
> app which will talk to the board via the serial cable.
>
> The board/app division of labour is up to the vendor.
>
> Max
>
>
>
>
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22

> Looks like that’s why MS uses FireWire for WinDbg.

BTW - can I put breakpoints to OHCI1394.SYS while running debugger via
FireWire? :-))))

I expect OHCI1394 to expose some simple hooks (like dump pointers in
storage stack) for KD to use. Am I right?

Max
Max, look at kd1394.dll I don’t think they are calling ohci1394.sys

Don Burn

23

RE: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usageWow! So many chips are shipped to market with debug hooks in them?

This reminds me on some story. Most PAL miniDV camcorders sold in EU and Russia has the “writing from 1394 to tape” option blocked due to some idiotic EU’s DRM regulations (is it not an idiocy? restrict me in copying and adorning my own videos? and commercial movies are not sold on DV).

Nevertheless, there are downloadable cracks for them, which allow this writing. I dunno how the crack is applied, some 1394 signaling seems to be the only way.

Another story. Firmware download to hard drives. Each vendor extends ATA spec in its own way for this. For instance, it is possible to detach the board from the servo, power it up and then run diags on it. Or to manage block remapping. Or to re-use the same board with another servo etc, etc.

Max

----- Original Message -----
From: Bi Chen
To: NT Developers Interest List
Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 8:51 PM
Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage

Hi, Max:

JTAG (boundary scan), software developer language, is an IEEE standard for controlling chip and read chip internal state in a standard way (group of signals or pins). Its capabilities can be used by chip diagnostic software (to some extent) and used by debugger. It is not FPGA (Field Programmable Gate Array). Most logic designer will include JTAG to their design to help debug their design.

Bi

-----Original Message-----
From: Maxim S. Shatskih [mailto:xxxxx@storagecraft.com]
Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 6:32 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage

hardware bug during the processor power-on/booting stage where normal debuger using JTAG has not be
>setup,

Then sorry, and what is JTAG? Is it not FPGA?

Max

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24

> Max, look at kd1394.dll I don’t think they are calling ohci1394.sys

OK. Let’s suppose they do not call ohci1394.

What will occur if, say, DV will choose the same isoch channel number
as the debugger have chosen? They must at least arbitrate the isoch
channel number over the bus to avoid some other 2 1394 nodes from
talking on the debugger’s “wavelength”.

Such an arbitration is rather hard a code. Have they copy-pasted it
from ohci1394/1394bus to kd1394?

Max

25

If your heap manager is a shovel.

Moreira, Alberto wrote in message
news:xxxxx@ntdev…
>
> If you carry your ICE in your pick up truck’s gun rack ?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jamey Kirby [mailto:xxxxx@storagecraft.com]
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 4:47 PM
> To: NT Developers Interest List
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
>
> OK, I will start the ball rolling:
>
> - If you think “hunt and peck” is something that the chickens do.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Jamey Kirby
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 1:34 PM
> To: NT Developers Interest List
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
> I am having thoughts of: “You know you are a red-neck programmer if…”
> :slight_smile:
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David J. Craig
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 12:50 PM
> To: NT Developers Interest List
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
> They offered an ICE that you could use with the software, but the
> software
> was available without the hardware. They also had a board containing
> ram
> that could keep the debugger on the ram which was configured as a ROM
> extension BIOS. This permitted you to get access to the last phases of
> the
> boot process to debug other ROM extensions or just the boot sequence
> itself.
> You had to use a reset switch to reboot and not the power switch.
> Periscope
> had a INT 1, NMI switch you could install. Too bad the company died.
> One
> of the first high tech companies in the Atlanta area.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: “Maxim S. Shatskih”
> To: “NT Developers Interest List”
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 9:35 AM
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
>
> > > PC can be the diagnostic tool for another PC. In fact, you can even
> > homebrew
> > > a logic analyzer, it’s not that outrageous a proposition.
> > >
> > > Hope this helps !
> >
> > Thanks Alberto!
> >
> > I had an experience of debugging both my NT4 driver + the custom board
> > with firmware loaded (not mine but with source) - all from the same
> > host, WinDbg and the custom debugger by the board’s vendor.
> >
> > Also - was Periscope debugger (SoftICE predecessor) an ICE or not?
> >
> > Max
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@yoshimuni.com
> > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@compuware.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or
disclose
> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us
immediately
> and then destroy it.
>
>
>
>

26

You break blinking strings of lights up into groups of four and

“Jamey Kirby” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
>
> OK, I will start the ball rolling:
>
> - If you think “hunt and peck” is something that the chickens do.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Jamey Kirby
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 1:34 PM
> To: NT Developers Interest List
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
> I am having thoughts of: “You know you are a red-neck programmer if…”
> :slight_smile:
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David J. Craig
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 12:50 PM
> To: NT Developers Interest List
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
> They offered an ICE that you could use with the software, but the
> software
> was available without the hardware. They also had a board containing
> ram
> that could keep the debugger on the ram which was configured as a ROM
> extension BIOS. This permitted you to get access to the last phases of
> the
> boot process to debug other ROM extensions or just the boot sequence
> itself.
> You had to use a reset switch to reboot and not the power switch.
> Periscope
> had a INT 1, NMI switch you could install. Too bad the company died.
> One
> of the first high tech companies in the Atlanta area.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: “Maxim S. Shatskih”
> To: “NT Developers Interest List”
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 9:35 AM
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
>
>
> > > PC can be the diagnostic tool for another PC. In fact, you can even
> > homebrew
> > > a logic analyzer, it’s not that outrageous a proposition.
> > >
> > > Hope this helps !
> >
> > Thanks Alberto!
> >
> > I had an experience of debugging both my NT4 driver + the custom board
> > with firmware loaded (not mine but with source) - all from the same
> > host, WinDbg and the custom debugger by the board’s vendor.
> >
> > Also - was Periscope debugger (SoftICE predecessor) an ICE or not?
> >
> > Max
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@yoshimuni.com
> > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>
>
>

27

DArn I hate when I do that …

You break blinking strings of lights up into groups of four and and then
count the hexidecimal values.

–
Gary G. Little
Have Computer, Will Travel …
909-698-3191
909-551-2105

“Gary G. Little” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
>
> You break blinking strings of lights up into groups of four and
>
>
> “Jamey Kirby” wrote in message
news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> >
> > OK, I will start the ball rolling:
> >
> > - If you think “hunt and peck” is something that the chickens do.
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> > [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Jamey Kirby
> > Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 1:34 PM
> > To: NT Developers Interest List
> > Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
> >
> > I am having thoughts of: “You know you are a red-neck programmer if…”
> > :slight_smile:
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> > [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David J. Craig
> > Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 12:50 PM
> > To: NT Developers Interest List
> > Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
> >
> > They offered an ICE that you could use with the software, but the
> > software
> > was available without the hardware. They also had a board containing
> > ram
> > that could keep the debugger on the ram which was configured as a ROM
> > extension BIOS. This permitted you to get access to the last phases of
> > the
> > boot process to debug other ROM extensions or just the boot sequence
> > itself.
> > You had to use a reset switch to reboot and not the power switch.
> > Periscope
> > had a INT 1, NMI switch you could install. Too bad the company died.
> > One
> > of the first high tech companies in the Atlanta area.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: “Maxim S. Shatskih”
> > To: “NT Developers Interest List”
> > Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 9:35 AM
> > Subject: [ntdev] RE: I am going to write a book - ITP usage
> >
> >
> > > > PC can be the diagnostic tool for another PC. In fact, you can even
> > > homebrew
> > > > a logic analyzer, it’s not that outrageous a proposition.
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps !
> > >
> > > Thanks Alberto!
> > >
> > > I had an experience of debugging both my NT4 driver + the custom board
> > > with firmware loaded (not mine but with source) - all from the same
> > > host, WinDbg and the custom debugger by the board’s vendor.
> > >
> > > Also - was Periscope debugger (SoftICE predecessor) an ICE or not?
> > >
> > > Max
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > —
> > > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@yoshimuni.com
> > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
> >
> >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>