List Server Problems on NTDEV

In case it’s not painfully obvious, we’ve had some network problems at OSR
over the past few days that affected the list servers.

These problems were caused by our bringing up an additional T1 and the
requisite network parts to support it – in large part in response to the
increased traffic on NTDEV/ NTFSD/ WINDBG (which now average a total of over
30,000 messages per day).

This attempt “was not entirely successful” – but at least we’re back to a
stable network now.

Thanks for your forebearance,

Peter
NTDEV/NTFSD/WINDBG List Slave


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I kind of liked the lag. It was fun to open up my mailbox this morning and
see 92 messages from Maxim. 30,000 messages a day, and most of them as
lacking in content as this one, wow.

-----Original Message-----
From: Peter G. Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com]
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 9:13 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] List Server Problems on NTDEV

In case it’s not painfully obvious, we’ve had some network
problems at OSR over the past few days that affected the list servers.

These problems were caused by our bringing up an additional
T1 and the requisite network parts to support it – in large
part in response to the increased traffic on NTDEV/ NTFSD/
WINDBG (which now average a total of over 30,000 messages per day).

This attempt “was not entirely successful” – but at least
we’re back to a stable network now.

Thanks for your forebearance,

Peter
NTDEV/NTFSD/WINDBG List Slave


You are currently subscribed to ntdev as:
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I do not remember sending 92 messages, maybe 20 or 30 :slight_smile:
I also do not remember content-lacking messages of me for the last days, though I have sent some several weeks ago.

Max

----- Original Message -----
From: “Roddy, Mark”
To: “NT Developers Interest List”
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 5:28 PM
Subject: [ntdev] RE: List Server Problems on NTDEV

> I kind of liked the lag. It was fun to open up my mailbox this morning and
> see 92 messages from Maxim. 30,000 messages a day, and most of them as
> lacking in content as this one, wow.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Peter G. Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com]
> > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 9:13 AM
> > To: NT Developers Interest List
> > Subject: [ntdev] List Server Problems on NTDEV
> >
> >
> > In case it’s not painfully obvious, we’ve had some network
> > problems at OSR over the past few days that affected the list servers.
> >
> > These problems were caused by our bringing up an additional
> > T1 and the requisite network parts to support it – in large
> > part in response to the increased traffic on NTDEV/ NTFSD/
> > WINDBG (which now average a total of over 30,000 messages per day).
> >
> > This attempt “was not entirely successful” – but at least
> > we’re back to a stable network now.
> >
> > Thanks for your forebearance,
> >
> > Peter
> > NTDEV/NTFSD/WINDBG List Slave
> >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as:
> > xxxxx@stratus.com To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> > leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com
> >
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com
>


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No it is the 30,000 messages a day that are mostly lacking in content, not
yours in particular. In fact you tend to stay on topic unlike me
(obviously.) I was just amazed at the volume. Sorry about the ambiguity.

-----Original Message-----
From: Maxim S. Shatskih [mailto:xxxxx@storagecraft.com]
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 10:23 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] RE: List Server Problems on NTDEV

I do not remember sending 92 messages, maybe 20 or 30 :slight_smile:
I also do not remember content-lacking messages of me for the
last days, though I have sent some several weeks ago.

Max

----- Original Message -----
From: “Roddy, Mark”
> To: “NT Developers Interest List”
> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 5:28 PM
> Subject: [ntdev] RE: List Server Problems on NTDEV
>
>
> > I kind of liked the lag. It was fun to open up my mailbox
> this morning
> > and see 92 messages from Maxim. 30,000 messages a day, and most of
> > them as lacking in content as this one, wow.
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Peter G. Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com]
> > > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 9:13 AM
> > > To: NT Developers Interest List
> > > Subject: [ntdev] List Server Problems on NTDEV
> > >
> > >
> > > In case it’s not painfully obvious, we’ve had some network
> > > problems at OSR over the past few days that affected the
> list servers.
> > >
> > > These problems were caused by our bringing up an additional
> > > T1 and the requisite network parts to support it – in large
> > > part in response to the increased traffic on NTDEV/ NTFSD/
> > > WINDBG (which now average a total of over 30,000 messages
> per day).
> > >
> > > This attempt “was not entirely successful” – but at least
> > > we’re back to a stable network now.
> > >
> > > Thanks for your forebearance,
> > >
> > > Peter
> > > NTDEV/NTFSD/WINDBG List Slave
> > >
> > >
> > > —
> > > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as:
> > > xxxxx@stratus.com To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> > > leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com
> > >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com To
> > unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com
> >
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as:
> xxxxx@stratus.com To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com
>


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>These problems were caused by our bringing up an additional T1 and the

requisite network parts to support it – in large part in response to the
increased traffic on NTDEV/ NTFSD/ WINDBG (which now average a total of over
30,000 messages per day).

Thanks for the update Peter.

That seems odd though, 30,000 messages should only be 120 MBytes/day
(assuming each message was 4 kbytes, which is very generous for text). A
128 kbps line should be able to deliver 1 GByte/day. Is it possible the
protocol overhead and DNS lookups could consume some HUGE amount of bandwidth?

Perhaps my math is fuzzy this early in the morning.

  • Jan

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Ah! But it’s not necessarily the aggregate throughput over a 1-day span
that’s the issue, it’s the burstiness of the traffic.

Most posts occur between 4AM and 6PM Eastern time. Because we want the list
to be maximally interactive, we have Lyris tuned to receive and send mail
fairly rapidly. This allows people to engage in as “near real time”
conversations as possible on the lists.

We presently send NTDEV and NTFSD email at a peak rate of about 4000-5000
messages per hour. Thus, something like two responses to a posting can be
distributed to ONE of the lists in about an hour. Our experience is that
this completely consumes an entire T1.

There are a ton of other issues that call for the infrastructure upgrade
here at OSR as well: We’re getting far too much latency on the T1 presently
used for list server traffic, etc, etc.

Of course, if folks were willing to wait 12 hours to get their postings, we
could throttle the throughput back. But we don’t think that’d be maximally
helpful to the development community.

Peter
NTDEV/NTFSD/WINDBG List Slave

-----Original Message-----
From: Jan Bottorff [mailto:xxxxx@pmatrix.com]
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 11:17 AM
To: Peter G. Viscarola
Cc: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: Re: [ntdev] List Server Problems on NTDEV

>These problems were caused by our bringing up an additional
T1 and the
>requisite network parts to support it – in large part in
response to
>the increased traffic on NTDEV/ NTFSD/ WINDBG (which now average a
>total of over 30,000 messages per day).

Thanks for the update Peter.

That seems odd though, 30,000 messages should only be 120 MBytes/day
(assuming each message was 4 kbytes, which is very generous
for text). A
128 kbps line should be able to deliver 1 GByte/day. Is it
possible the
protocol overhead and DNS lookups could consume some HUGE
amount of bandwidth?

Perhaps my math is fuzzy this early in the morning.

  • Jan

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> In my TDI sample code (which works):

1.) I use IoAllocateIrp instead of TdiBuildInternalDeviceControlIrp.

I also use IoAllocateIrp in my sockets library. Works fine, at least for TCPIP.

Max


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On 01/11/02, “Jan Bottorff ” wrote:

> That seems odd though, 30,000 messages should only be 120 MBytes/day
> (assuming each message was 4 kbytes, which is very generous for text

Unfortunately, many people don’t trim the original message to what’s
relevant, do include the OutLook HTML attachment, do leave all the old
headers included, etc…, causing messages to balloon in size. A 4K
average would be a pleasure!

Don’t mind me, I’m just feeling old crotchety today!

Scott


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