1394 Device Problem

Hi,

Following the installation of XP SP3 on an XP Pro system, I have seen a problem with 1394 device removal. A single device does not get removed from the bus when it is powered down even though a bus reset is generated (the device was removed successfully prior to SP3). If multiple devices are connected, everything works fine.

The problem sounds like it is the issue described by KB 887170, although this article relates to XP Home.

Can anyone else confirm this behaviour on XP Pro or suggest a workaround/fix?

Thanks,

Robin

For almost all practical purposes, an issue affecting XP Home will also affect XP Pro.

  • S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@oxinst.co.uk
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 03:47
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

Hi,

Following the installation of XP SP3 on an XP Pro system, I have seen a problem with 1394 device removal. A single device does not get removed from the bus when it is powered down even though a bus reset is generated (the device was removed successfully prior to SP3). If multiple devices are connected, everything works fine.

The problem sounds like it is the issue described by KB 887170, although this article relates to XP Home.

Can anyone else confirm this behaviour on XP Pro or suggest a workaround/fix?

Thanks,

Robin


NTDEV is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

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Ken Johnson wrote:

For almost all practical purposes, an issue affecting XP Home will
also affect XP Pro.

  • S

Why do you sign your messages “-S” if your name is Ken Johnson?

Because the “from” address for this mail account is Skywing valhallalegends[dot]com (and likewise the “friendly name” associated with outbound messages).

The web interface likes to discard the SMTP/NNTP from address and instead use a value from its internal database, which means that you’re not likely to see the actual from value. There is a way to change what the listserv thinks my display name is, but I haven?t gotten around to doing it.

I have traditionally used “Skywing” and not my real name with this mail address for some number of years now, and thus haven’t really seen fit to switch it.

- S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@gmail.com
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:25 AM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

Ken Johnson wrote:

> For almost all practical purposes, an issue affecting XP Home will
> also affect XP Pro.
>
> - S

Why do you sign your messages “-S” if your name is Ken Johnson?


NTDEV is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

I always wondered how people know your name is Ken :wink: A way how to find
out who uses which interface to read the list.

Best regards,

Michal Vodicka
UPEK, Inc.
[xxxxx@upek.com, http://www.upek.com]

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Skywing
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 5:58 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

Because the “from” address for this mail account is Skywing
valhallalegends[dot]com (and likewise the “friendly
> name” associated with outbound messages).
>
> The web interface likes to discard the SMTP/NNTP from address
> and instead use a value from its internal database, which
> means that you’re not likely to see the actual from value.
> There is a way to change what the listserv thinks my display
> name is, but I haven’t gotten around to doing it.
>
> I have traditionally used “Skywing” and not my real name with
> this mail address for some number of years now, and thus
> haven’t really seen fit to switch it.
>
> - S
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of
> xxxxx@gmail.com
> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:25 AM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem
>
> Ken Johnson wrote:
>
> > For almost all practical purposes, an issue affecting XP Home will
> > also affect XP Pro.
> >
> > - S
>
> Why do you sign your messages “-S” if your name is Ken Johnson?
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online
> at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online
> at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>

Psychic powers!

Though, one can also figure it by looking at the received message headers if you are using the SMTP interface.

A “Newsgroups:” (or “X-Mailer: Lyris ListManager Newsgroup Interface”) header indicates that someone posted via NNTP.
A “X-OSROnline: Posted via forum” header signifies that the message was posted via the web interface. Also, web interface posted messages are always in UTF8 and thus used to break the SMTP interface due to some Lyris silliness.
An “X-Env-Sender” header and a lack of the above indicators means that the message was received via SMTP.

You could produce some interesting demographics as to who uses what interfaces, though. Anton uses the web interface, Don Burn and Martin O’Brien use NNTP, and many of the Microsofties use SMTP (probably for nice automagical Exchange synchronization of read messages across devices, if I could hazard a guess).

  • S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Michal Vodicka
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:46 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

I always wondered how people know your name is Ken :wink: A way how to find
out who uses which interface to read the list.

Best regards,

Michal Vodicka
UPEK, Inc.
[xxxxx@upek.com, http://www.upek.com]

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Skywing
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 5:58 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

Because the “from” address for this mail account is Skywing
valhallalegends[dot]com (and likewise the “friendly
> name” associated with outbound messages).
>
> The web interface likes to discard the SMTP/NNTP from address
> and instead use a value from its internal database, which
> means that you’re not likely to see the actual from value.
> There is a way to change what the listserv thinks my display
> name is, but I haven’t gotten around to doing it.
>
> I have traditionally used “Skywing” and not my real name with
> this mail address for some number of years now, and thus
> haven’t really seen fit to switch it.
>
> - S
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of
> xxxxx@gmail.com
> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:25 AM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem
>
> Ken Johnson wrote:
>
> > For almost all practical purposes, an issue affecting XP Home will
> > also affect XP Pro.
> >
> > - S
>
> Why do you sign your messages “-S” if your name is Ken Johnson?
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online
> at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online
> at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>


NTDEV is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

> -----Original Message-----

From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Skywing
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 8:17 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

Anton uses the web interface,

I guess it explains something… :wink:

Best regards,

Michal Vodicka
UPEK, Inc.
[xxxxx@upek.com, http://www.upek.com]

Indeed I do, though it wasn’t my first choice, and my reason for switching involved the ‘from’ address, as it happens. I started
with e-mail, but this came in to conflict with my employer’s never ending goal of switching up the three letter acronym we go by
every year or so - EVI -> EDO -> ITT. Although I didn’t really want to change my identity on the list (depending on interface)
(head hunters and some of the other less technically inclined just do a simple search), after I tried and liked the web interface,
but that little box and I just didn’t get along all that well, and then Thunderbird, which didn’t really do it for me either, I
decided it was time to get over myself and just resubscribe. I was all set to do that, until one day when the value of the
inability to post from Outlook became clear when it prevented me from posting something that I thought I had addressed privately but
had not. This seemed like a feature worth keeping, and it’s saved me a few times since from some serious embarrassment, if nothing
else.

mm

Skywing wrote:

Psychic powers!

Though, one can also figure it by looking at the received message headers if you are using the SMTP interface.

A “Newsgroups:” (or “X-Mailer: Lyris ListManager Newsgroup Interface”) header indicates that someone posted via NNTP.
A “X-OSROnline: Posted via forum” header signifies that the message was posted via the web interface. Also, web interface posted messages are always in UTF8 and thus used to break the SMTP interface due to some Lyris silliness.
An “X-Env-Sender” header and a lack of the above indicators means that the message was received via SMTP.

You could produce some interesting demographics as to who uses what interfaces, though. Anton uses the web interface, Don Burn and Martin O’Brien use NNTP, and many of the Microsofties use SMTP (probably for nice automagical Exchange synchronization of read messages across devices, if I could hazard a guess).

  • S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Michal Vodicka
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:46 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

I always wondered how people know your name is Ken :wink: A way how to find
out who uses which interface to read the list.

Best regards,

Michal Vodicka
UPEK, Inc.
[xxxxx@upek.com, http://www.upek.com]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Skywing
> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 5:58 PM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: RE: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem
>
> Because the “from” address for this mail account is Skywing
> valhallalegends[dot]com (and likewise the “friendly
>> name” associated with outbound messages).
>>
>> The web interface likes to discard the SMTP/NNTP from address
>> and instead use a value from its internal database, which
>> means that you’re not likely to see the actual from value.
>> There is a way to change what the listserv thinks my display
>> name is, but I haven’t gotten around to doing it.
>>
>> I have traditionally used “Skywing” and not my real name with
>> this mail address for some number of years now, and thus
>> haven’t really seen fit to switch it.
>>
>> - S
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of
>> xxxxx@gmail.com
>> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:25 AM
>> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
>> Subject: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem
>>
>> Ken Johnson wrote:
>>
>>> For almost all practical purposes, an issue affecting XP Home will
>>> also affect XP Pro.
>>>
>>> - S
>> Why do you sign your messages “-S” if your name is Ken Johnson?
>>
>> —
>> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>>
>> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
>> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online
>> at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> —
>> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>>
>> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
>> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online
>> at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>

As Ken said, “Newsgroup Interface” in the header is the definitive key to indicate that the message was posted via NNTP. “via forum” in the header is the definitive indicator of a message posted via the web interface. Lack of either of these is the only definitive indicator that the posting originated via email.

If you’re curious, the methods used to post are presently about 20% NNTP, 40% email, and 40% web interface.

Peter
OSR

>> Anton uses the web interface,

I guess it explains something… :wink:

I would say so…

Even more, I am not a list subscriber. I tried it , but within few days my box got literally flooded with countless messages, mostly on the topics I have not interest in (like WDF), and managing it became just a nightmare.

Why don’t you want to try my approach??? If you do, I can assure you that you will be complaining about my posts much less often than you currently do - you will be able to to read exactly what you are interested in and skip the rest…

Anton Bassov

This is a newsgroup and works very well that way. I don’t usually do it,
but you can unhide read messages and review the thread to understand the
problem. You can also save interesting messages in the Outlook Express
email folders. If I wanted to eliminate your messages it is easy to add a
name to the blocked list.

wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
>>> Anton uses the web interface,
>
>>I guess it explains something… :wink:
>
> I would say so…
>
> Even more, I am not a list subscriber. I tried it , but within few days my
> box got literally flooded with countless messages, mostly on the topics I
> have not interest in (like WDF), and managing it became just a nightmare.
>
> Why don’t you want to try my approach??? If you do, I can assure you that
> you will be complaining about my posts much less often than you currently
> do - you will be able to to read exactly what you are interested in and
> skip the rest…
>
> Anton Bassov
>

> If I wanted to eliminate your messages it is easy to add a name to the blocked list.

IIRC, you get messages from the list, rather than poster, so that blocking as given poster is, apparently, not as easy as it sounds…

Anton Bassov

Except when you’re reading the group with a NEWSREADER… as David implied he is.

Peter
OSR

> -----Original Message-----

From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of
xxxxx@hotmail.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 6:34 AM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE:[ntdev] 1394 Device Problem

Even more, I am not a list subscriber. I tried it , but
within few days my box got literally flooded with countless
messages, mostly on the topics I have not interest in (like
WDF), and managing it became just a nightmare.

Maybe you should attend e-mail management course for beginners :wink:
Reasonable mail clients allow to set filters and rules and manage mails
automatically. Even Outlook allows it.

Why don’t you want to try my approach???

Because I was under impression web inteface is specially designed for
masochists which is not my favorite deviation :wink: Peter shocked me when
said 40% people are using it.

If you do, I can
assure you that you will be complaining about my posts much
less often than you currently do - you will be able to to
read exactly what you are interested in and skip the rest…

I don’t see any difference. I read mostly only what interests me
somewhat but the problem isn’t the topic; it is the way how you turn
every discussion (well, almost) to tiresome off topic flame. I can skip
your messages but there are always replies from people which have
something to say.

Best regards,

Michal Vodicka
UPEK, Inc.
[xxxxx@upek.com, http://www.upek.com]

David Craig wrote:

This is a newsgroup and works very well that way.

And I guess that’s the issue. Had I written this post, I would have
said “This is an email list and works very well that way.”

We all assume everyone is like us. Personally, I was stunned when I saw
the statistics on how this group is used. I assumed the usage was 90%
email, 8% NNTP, 2% web forum.

I don’t understand how anyone can productively use the web forum
version, but apparently 40% do.


Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

LOL… Exactly, Tim. We all default to assuming everyone’s like us.

I *exclusively* use the web interface, and have been doing so since I wrote it (using the look/feel formatting from Jelsoft). Others here at OSR are about equally split between NNTP and email.

One of the strengths of this list has been that it gives folks the ability to choose the interface they prefer. Keeping all three running is a PITA, but apparently worth it.

One of the advantages of the web interface is that it allows us to bring added value to the interface over time, when and if the community wants it. For example, things we’ve considered include: Listing related posts on a topic, allowing people to give “ups” or “downs” to a particular reply (enough “downs” and the reply will gray out… enough “ups” and the reply is shown in bold), and letting people rate the posters (providing an online “reputation”), allowing people to mark individual replies as worthy of automatic promotion to an FAQ answer, etc. We’re not close to doing any of these things yet, but we’ve considered each of them.

Peter
OSR

> Maybe you should attend e-mail management course for beginners ;-

Well, I am just not kind of a person who attends courses for whatever reasons - I prefer to learn things on my own. However, if you take my “e-mail management skills”, they are indeed, exactly at the level of someone who plans to attend such a course. Somehow it happened that, for this or that reason, I have never used e-mail clients. I think depends mainly on what you are accustomed to - old habits die hard.

The same applies to development - IIRC, I read some Matt Pietrek’s article where he says that he just cannot stand any form of IDE, and prefers to do everything on the command line. In the Linux words, some people do all text editing either in vi or in emac, rather than in GUI-based text editor. The list goes on and on…

Anton Bassov