Re: Beginner guide..

A rather radical view but I mean this in a good way. But before getting into
driver development it helps to have a very good grasp of OS and comp
architecture, the principles not necessarily how one particular OS or
platform does what. Not the how, the why!!

“Smarty Selva” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> Hello Friends,
>
> I am a beginner in the field of Driver development. I want to study
> about developing drivers in windows. Please tell me some e-book, which
> taught everything from the basics so that I can grasp things easily
>
> –
> Regards,
> SELVA
>

As a beginner who had to learn to write a driver in double quick time and
now wants to forget it, can I suggest:

“Programming the Windows Driver Model” 2nd ed by Walter Oney I’d say is an
essential.

(not an e-book so plant a tree before reading).

We’re waiting for a book on WDF from OSR with great aniticpation, maybe it
will supercede Walter’s.

Then start with an example driver from the dev kit and play with it until it
does what you need. You’ll discover that the examples are so full of bugs
and bad design that they are object lessons in the best way of learning,
i.e. by making mistakes.

Also read anything you can find on OSR.

You actually only need to understand a subset of the OS architecture. You’ll
discover that it has been cobbled together by so many different people over
the years that it’s not very coherent. The wonder is works (mostly). The
problem is that you step from the totally untrusted user app area to the
totally trusted kernel. It’s a pity there are not intermediate steps so we
beginners (and many so called profesisonal offerings) can’t trample over the
system so easily…

Good luck

Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: bank kus
Newsgroups: ntdev
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 12:23 PM
Subject: Re:[ntdev] Beginner guide…

A rather radical view but I mean this in a good way. But before getting into
driver development it helps to have a very good grasp of OS and comp
architecture, the principles not necessarily how one particular OS or
platform does what. Not the how, the why!!

“Smarty Selva” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> Hello Friends,
>
> I am a beginner in the field of Driver development. I want to study
> about developing drivers in windows. Please tell me some e-book, which
> taught everything from the basics so that I can grasp things easily
>
> –
> Regards,
> SELVA
>


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

Try to read ‘Windows Device Drivers’ by Art Baker.
Its a best book - to start with Windows Drives. Yup, as Mike mentioned, the examples mentioned in DDK kit are really good :slight_smile:

Well a couple of things here, first you should get the seond edition titles
“The Windows 2000 Device Driver Book” this one covers Plug and Play.
Second thing, either edition has a number of errors. That being said, it
is an easy to read book that covers much of the basics for driver writing,
prior to the WDK.


Don Burn (MVP, Windows DDK)
Windows 2k/XP/2k3 Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Website: http://www.windrvr.com
Blog: http://msmvps.com/blogs/WinDrvr
Remove StopSpam to reply

wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> Try to read ‘Windows Device Drivers’ by Art Baker.
> Its a best book - to start with Windows Drives. Yup, as Mike mentioned,
> the examples mentioned in DDK kit are really good :slight_smile:
>

I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx), “Introductory driver writing resources” (http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx) and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx) interesting.

Ilias

Some books had been very helpful to me.

Windows NT Device Driver Development
(Formerly ISBN 1578700582, published by MacMillan Technical Publishing)
http://www.osr.com/publications_main.shtml
In my opinion, this is the best one although I don’t quiet agree with
the i/o cancellation section.

Programming the Windows Driver Model 2nd edition
http://www.amazon.com/Programming-Microsoft-Windows-Driver-Second/dp/073
5618038
Most technically accurate book on WDM but not beginner friendly.

Windows NT File System Internals : A Developer’s Guide
http://www.amazon.com/Windows-File-System-Internals-Developers/dp/156592
2492
Non-FS developer can benefit from the book quite a bit.

What kind of Windows driver are you planning to write?

Calvin Guan (expiring DDK MVP)
NetXtreme NTX Miniport
Broadcom Corporation
Connecting Everything(r)

“Smarty Selva” wrote in message
news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> > Hello Friends,
> >
> > I am a beginner in the field of Driver development. I want to study
> > about developing drivers in windows. Please tell me some e-book,
which
> > taught everything from the basics so that I can grasp things easily
> >
> > –
> > Regards,
> > SELVA
> >

This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the sturcture?.
How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some background might
ask the following questions first -

  1. What is a windows driver ?

  2. Why do we need a driver ?

  3. What is the form of the binary file?

  4. How they get installed/removed/ get executed?

  5. Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?

  6. Where can I get my hands dirty?

  7. What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?

  8. Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there
    many or just one stucture?

  9. Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts:
    re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently
    threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.

  10. Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc. can
    perhaps be suggested.

Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look at
:-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle.
THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -

Introduction
Chronology
Comprehension
Completeness
Closing.

None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it.
He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.

Just a thought.

-pro

On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
>
> I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning
> about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
> Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is
> that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before
> starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without
> creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should
> understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth
> Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by
> Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and
> then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about
> “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx),
> “Introductory driver writing resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx)
> and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx)
> interesting.
>
> Ilias
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>

Please be nice to the newbies. For the File Systems Internals book try:
https://www.osronline.com/custom.cfm?name=index_fullframeset.cfm&pageURL=https://www.osronline.com/store/index.cfm.
It is only $65 there and you can get the diskette contents from the O’Reilly
website - the original publisher as I don’t think they include it.

I think I like the brown cover for the Viscarola and Mason book. They used
to give them away during some of their courses.

“Calvin (Hao) Guan” wrote in message
news:xxxxx@ntdev…
Some books had been very helpful to me.

Windows NT Device Driver Development
(Formerly ISBN 1578700582, published by MacMillan Technical Publishing)
http://www.osr.com/publications_main.shtml
In my opinion, this is the best one although I don’t quiet agree with
the i/o cancellation section.

Programming the Windows Driver Model 2nd edition
http://www.amazon.com/Programming-Microsoft-Windows-Driver-Second/dp/073
5618038
Most technically accurate book on WDM but not beginner friendly.

Windows NT File System Internals : A Developer’s Guide
http://www.amazon.com/Windows-File-System-Internals-Developers/dp/156592
2492
Non-FS developer can benefit from the book quite a bit.

What kind of Windows driver are you planning to write?

Calvin Guan (expiring DDK MVP)
NetXtreme NTX Miniport
Broadcom Corporation
Connecting Everything(r)

>
> “Smarty Selva” wrote in message
news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> > Hello Friends,
> >
> > I am a beginner in the field of Driver development. I want to study
> > about developing drivers in windows. Please tell me some e-book,
which
> > taught everything from the basics so that I can grasp things easily
> >
> > –
> > Regards,
> > SELVA
> >

Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my findings. This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog. I don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time and new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.

Just to answer a few of your questions, though:

My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing resources” (http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx).
Over there I have links to articles like http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233 (The Basics: Exactly what is a driver).

I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll find the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.

Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental OS concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition, in my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”) I provide links for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.

So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the following:

post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources

(that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth). But after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my opinion on driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and different IDEs that are used by developers.

Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make my blog better.

Ilias


From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…

This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some background might ask the following questions first -

  1. What is a windows driver ?

  2. Why do we need a driver ?

  3. What is the form of the binary file?

  4. How they get installed/removed/ get executed?

  5. Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?

  6. Where can I get my hands dirty?

  7. What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?

  8. Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there many or just one stucture?

  9. Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts: re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.

  10. Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc. can perhaps be suggested.

Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle. THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -

Introduction
Chronology
Comprehension
Completeness
Closing.

None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it. He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.

Just a thought.

-pro

On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > wrote:
I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx), “Introductory driver writing resources” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx) and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx) interesting.

Ilias


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

— Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).

Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies would
be able to follow it.

-pro

On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
>
> Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver
> development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my findings.
> This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit
> from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog. I
> don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as
> “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time and
> new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.
>
> Just to answer a few of your questions, though:
>
> My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing
> resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx
> ).
> Over there I have links to articles like
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing
> device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233 (The
> Basics: Exactly what is a driver).
>
> I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll find
> the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.
>
> Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide
> links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting
> material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental OS
> concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition, in
> my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”) I provide
> links for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.
>
> So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and
> afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the
> following:
>
> post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
> post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
> posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources
>
> (that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth). But
> after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an
> introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my opinion on
> driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and
> different IDEs that are used by developers.
>
> Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make my
> blog better.
>
> Ilias
>
> ________________________________________
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [xxxxx@lists.osr.com]
> On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>
> This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
> sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some
> background might ask the following questions first -
>
> 1) What is a windows driver ?
>
> 2) Why do we need a driver ?
>
> 3) What is the form of the binary file?
>
> 4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?
>
> 5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?
>
> 6) Where can I get my hands dirty?
>
> 7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?
>
> 8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there
> many or just one stucture?
>
> 9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts:
> re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently
> threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.
>
> 10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc.
> can perhaps be suggested.
>
> Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look
> at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle.
> THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -
>
> Introduction
> Chronology
> Comprehension
> Completeness
> Closing.
>
> None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it.
> He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.
>
> Just a thought.
>
> -pro
>
>
> On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > xxxxx@microsoft.com>> wrote:
> I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning
> about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
> Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is
> that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before
> starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without
> creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should
> understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth
> Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by
> Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and
> then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about
> “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx),
> “Introductory driver writing resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx)
> and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx)
> interesting.
>
> Ilias
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List
> Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>

Do I have your permission to use your list of questions in my next post? I was thinking of writing a post with the questions and where they can be found in the blog.

Ilias


From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 9:00 AM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…

I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).

Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies would be able to follow it.

-pro

On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > wrote:
Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my findings. This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog. I don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time and new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.

Just to answer a few of your questions, though:

My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing resources” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx).
Over there I have links to articles like http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233 (The Basics: Exactly what is a driver).

I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll find the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.

Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental OS concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition, in my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”) I provide links for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.

So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the following:

post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources

(that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth). But after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my opinion on driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and different IDEs that are used by developers.

Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make my blog better.

Ilias

________________________________________
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com mailto:xxxxx [xxxxx@lists.osr.commailto:xxxxx] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.commailto:xxxxx]
Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…

This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some background might ask the following questions first -

1) What is a windows driver ?

2) Why do we need a driver ?

3) What is the form of the binary file?

4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?

5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?

6) Where can I get my hands dirty?

7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?

8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there many or just one stucture?

9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts: re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.

10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc. can perhaps be suggested.

Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle. THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -

Introduction
Chronology
Comprehension
Completeness
Closing.

None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it. He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.

Just a thought.

-pro

On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis mailto:xxxxx>> wrote:
I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx), “Introductory driver writing resources” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx) and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx) interesting.

Ilias


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

— Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

— Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer</mailto:xxxxx></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:xxxxx>

Absolutely.

I would also appreciate if you could revamp the questions by adding and/or
modifying whatever way you like. Please keep in mind that it should be
useful to novice or newbies, so that they could learn as well as refer to it
whenever they feel like. ( As an example: I would like to visit this blog
once a while, since it does have some good links :slight_smile:

Also I would like to see ( of course if the time permits :), different forms
/patterns/structures of different types of windows drivers. I’m neither
familiar with kmdf nor umdf, but if I look at the base WDM there are
different structures for some major different types of drivers, including
file system and file filters. And there are more callbacks type framework
today than it used to be in nt 3.1 / 3.5 time. So I’m not sure if you
already have links to channel 9 where for example some nice talks of ( Neal,
Molly, and Nar ) that gives a very nice introductory coverage of filter
manager, cache manager and i/o architecure.

*I may be over-optimistic, but recently I have seen some people started
working in file systems without any windows driver background, and it is
hard for almost anyone in that shoe*. - And I call this M&M syndrom :-).
Almost everyone loves to buy and / or eat it. BTW, M&M == Marketing &
Management.

-pro

On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
>
> Do I have your permission to use your list of questions in my next post? I
> was thinking of writing a post with the questions and where they can be
> found in the blog.
>
> Ilias
>
>
>
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [xxxxx@lists.osr.com]
> On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.com]
> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 9:00 AM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>
> I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).
>
> Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies would
> be able to follow it.
>
> -pro
>
>
> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > xxxxx@microsoft.com>> wrote:
> Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver
> development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my findings.
> This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit
> from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog. I
> don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as
> “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time and
> new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.
>
> Just to answer a few of your questions, though:
>
> My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing
> resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx
> ).
> Over there I have links to articles like
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing
> device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233 (The
> Basics: Exactly what is a driver).
>
> I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll find
> the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.
>
> Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide
> links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting
> material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental OS
> concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition, in
> my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”) I provide
> links for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.
>
> So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and
> afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the
> following:
>
> post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
> post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
> posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources
>
> (that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth). But
> after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an
> introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my opinion on
> driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and
> different IDEs that are used by developers.
>
> Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make my
> blog better.
>
> Ilias
>
>

> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com mailto:> xxxxx@lists.osr.com> [xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> mailto:xxxxx] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
> xxxxx@gmail.commailto:xxxxx]
> Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>
> This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
> sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some
> background might ask the following questions first -
>
> 1) What is a windows driver ?
>
> 2) Why do we need a driver ?
>
> 3) What is the form of the binary file?
>
> 4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?
>
> 5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?
>
> 6) Where can I get my hands dirty?
>
> 7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?
>
> 8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there
> many or just one stucture?
>
> 9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts:
> re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently
> threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.
>
> 10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc.
> can perhaps be suggested.
>
> Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look
> at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle.
> THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -
>
> Introduction
> Chronology
> Comprehension
> Completeness
> Closing.
>
> None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it.
> He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.
>
> Just a thought.
>
> -pro
>
>
> On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > xxxxx@microsoft.com>mailto:xxxxx> xxxxx@microsoft.com>>> wrote:
> I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning
> about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
> Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is
> that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before
> starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without
> creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should
> understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth
> Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by
> Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and
> then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about
> “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx),
> “Introductory driver writing resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx)
> and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx)
> interesting.
>
> Ilias
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List
> Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List
> Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:>

FYI, my blog is going to start focusing a bit more on WDF design patterns as well over the course of the coming months

d


From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 11:52 AM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…

Absolutely.
?
I would also appreciate if you could revamp the questions by adding and/or modifying whatever way you like. Please keep in mind that it should be useful to novice or newbies, so that they could learn as well as refer to it whenever they feel like. ( As an example: I would like to visit this blog once a while, since it does have some good links :slight_smile:
?
Also I would like to see ( of course if the time permits :), different forms /patterns/structures of different types of windows drivers. I’m neither familiar with kmdf nor umdf, but if I look at the base WDM there are different structures for some major different types of drivers, including file system and file filters. And there are more callbacks type framework today than it used to be in nt 3.1 / 3.5 time. So I’m not sure if you already have links to channel 9 where for example some nice talks of ( Neal, Molly, and Nar ) that gives a very nice introductory coverage of filter manager, cache manager and i/o architecure.?
?
?*I may be over-optimistic, but recently I have seen some people started working in file systems without any windows driver background, and it is hard for almost anyone in that shoe*.? - And I call this M&M syndrom :-). Almost everyone loves to buy and / or eat it.??BTW, M&M ==? Marketing & Management.?
?
-pro
?

?
On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
Do I have your permission to use your list of questions in my next post? I was thinking of writing a post with the questions and where they can be found in the blog.

Ilias


From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 9:00 AM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…

I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).

Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies would be able to follow it.

-pro

On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis < xxxxx@microsoft.commailto:xxxxx> wrote:
Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my findings. This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog. I don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time and new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.

Just to answer a few of your questions, though:

My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing resources” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx).
Over there I have links to articles like http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233 (The Basics: Exactly what is a driver).

I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll find the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.

Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental OS concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition, in my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”)??I provide links for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.

So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the following:

post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources

(that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth). But after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my opinion on driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and different IDEs that are used by developers.

Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make my blog better.

Ilias


From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com mailto:xxxxx [xxxxx@lists.osr.com<mailto: xxxxx>] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [xxxxx@gmail.commailto:xxxxx]
Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…

This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog???A newbie with some background might ask the following questions first -

1) What is a windows driver ?

2) Why do we need a driver ?

3) What is the form of the binary file?

4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?

5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?

6) Where can I get my hands dirty?

7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?

8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there many or just one stucture?

9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts: re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.

10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc. can perhaps be suggested.

Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle. THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -

Introduction
Chronology
Comprehension
Completeness
Closing.

None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it. He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.

Just a thought.

-pro

On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis <mailto: xxxxx>>> wrote:
I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx), “Introductory driver writing resources” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx) and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” ( http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx) interesting.

Ilias


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

— Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

— Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

— Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer</mailto:></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:xxxxx>

That would just be fantastic :-).

Someday I would either start crying out very loud or start becoming violent
if the WDF book from osr does not comeout anytime soon :-). I know all
osr-giants are very very busy, but how long should we wait ???.

-pro

On 3/10/07, Doron Holan wrote:
>
> FYI, my blog is going to start focusing a bit more on WDF design patterns
> as well over the course of the coming months
>
> d
>
>
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:
> xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha
> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 11:52 AM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>
> Absolutely.
>
> I would also appreciate if you could revamp the questions by adding and/or
> modifying whatever way you like. Please keep in mind that it should be
> useful to novice or newbies, so that they could learn as well as refer to it
> whenever they feel like. ( As an example: I would like to visit this blog
> once a while, since it does have some good links :slight_smile:
>
> Also I would like to see ( of course if the time permits :), different
> forms /patterns/structures of different types of windows drivers. I’m
> neither familiar with kmdf nor umdf, but if I look at the base WDM there are
> different structures for some major different types of drivers, including
> file system and file filters. And there are more callbacks type framework
> today than it used to be in nt 3.1 / 3.5 time. So I’m not sure if you
> already have links to channel 9 where for example some nice talks of ( Neal,
> Molly, and Nar ) that gives a very nice introductory coverage of filter
> manager, cache manager and i/o architecure.
>
> I may be over-optimistic, but recently I have seen some people started
> working in file systems without any windows driver background, and it is
> hard for almost anyone in that shoe
. - And I call this M&M syndrom :-).
> Almost everyone loves to buy and / or eat it.BTW, M&M == Marketing &
> Management.
>
> -pro
>
>
>
>
> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
> Do I have your permission to use your list of questions in my next post? I
> was thinking of writing a post with the questions and where they can be
> found in the blog.
>
> Ilias
>
>
>

> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
> xxxxx@gmail.com]
> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 9:00 AM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>
> I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).
>
> Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies would
> be able to follow it.
>
> -pro
>
>
> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis < xxxxx@microsoft.commailto:> xxxxx@microsoft.com>> wrote:
> Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver
> development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my findings.
> This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit
> from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog. I
> don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as
> “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time and
> new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.
>
> Just to answer a few of your questions, though:
>
> My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing
> resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx
> ).
> Over there I have links to articles like
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing
> device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233 (The
> Basics: Exactly what is a driver).
>
> I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll find
> the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.
>
> Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide
> links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting
> material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental OS
> concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition, in
> my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”)I provide links
> for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.
>
> So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and
> afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the
> following:
>
> post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
> post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
> posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources
>
> (that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth). But
> after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an
> introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my opinion on
> driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and
> different IDEs that are used by developers.
>
> Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make my
> blog better.
>
> Ilias
>
> ________________________________________
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com mailto:> xxxxx@lists.osr.com> [xxxxx@lists.osr.commailto:> xxxxx@lists.osr.com>] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
> xxxxx@gmail.commailto:xxxxx]
> Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>
> This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
> sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog?A newbie with some
> background might ask the following questions first -
>
> 1) What is a windows driver ?
>
> 2) Why do we need a driver ?
>
> 3) What is the form of the binary file?
>
> 4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?
>
> 5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?
>
> 6) Where can I get my hands dirty?
>
> 7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?
>
> 8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there
> many or just one stucture?
>
> 9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS concepts:
> re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch. inherently
> threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.
>
> 10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc.
> can perhaps be suggested.
>
> Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to look
> at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern lifestyle.
> THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -
>
> Introduction
> Chronology
> Comprehension
> Completeness
> Closing.
>
> None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads it.
> He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.
>
> Just a thought.
>
> -pro
>
>
> On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > xxxxx@microsoft.com><mailto: xxxxx>> xxxxx@microsoft.com>>> wrote:
> I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning
> about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
> Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is
> that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before
> starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without
> creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should
> understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals, Fourth
> Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000” by
> Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text) and
> then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about
> “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx),
> “Introductory driver writing resources” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx)
> and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx)
> interesting.
>
> Ilias
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List
> Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List
> Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the List
> Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
></mailto:></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:></mailto:></mailto:>

Prokash,

The OSR book maybe delayed but Microsoft Press will have a book by the
WDF team out next month. See
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/books/10512.aspx


Don Burn (MVP, Windows DDK)
Windows 2k/XP/2k3 Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Website: http://www.windrvr.com
Blog: http://msmvps.com/blogs/WinDrvr
Remove StopSpam to reply

“Prokash Sinha” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> That would just be fantastic :-).
>
> Someday I would either start crying out very loud or start becoming
> violent
> if the WDF book from osr does not comeout anytime soon :-). I know all
> osr-giants are very very busy, but how long should we wait ???.
>
> -pro
>
>
>
> On 3/10/07, Doron Holan wrote:
>>
>> FYI, my blog is going to start focusing a bit more on WDF design
>> patterns
>> as well over the course of the coming months
>>
>> d
>>
>>
>> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:
>> xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha
>> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 11:52 AM
>> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
>> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>>
>> Absolutely.
>>
>> I would also appreciate if you could revamp the questions by adding
>> and/or
>> modifying whatever way you like. Please keep in mind that it should be
>> useful to novice or newbies, so that they could learn as well as refer
>> to it
>> whenever they feel like. ( As an example: I would like to visit this
>> blog
>> once a while, since it does have some good links :slight_smile:
>>
>> Also I would like to see ( of course if the time permits :), different
>> forms /patterns/structures of different types of windows drivers. I’m
>> neither familiar with kmdf nor umdf, but if I look at the base WDM there
>> are
>> different structures for some major different types of drivers,
>> including
>> file system and file filters. And there are more callbacks type
>> framework
>> today than it used to be in nt 3.1 / 3.5 time. So I’m not sure if you
>> already have links to channel 9 where for example some nice talks of (
>> Neal,
>> Molly, and Nar ) that gives a very nice introductory coverage of filter
>> manager, cache manager and i/o architecure.
>>
>> I may be over-optimistic, but recently I have seen some people started
>> working in file systems without any windows driver background, and it is
>> hard for almost anyone in that shoe
. - And I call this M&M syndrom :-).
>> Almost everyone loves to buy and / or eat it.BTW, M&M == Marketing &
>> Management.
>>
>> -pro
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
>> Do I have your permission to use your list of questions in my next post?
>> I
>> was thinking of writing a post with the questions and where they can be
>> found in the blog.
>>
>> Ilias
>>
>>
>>

>> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>> [xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
>> xxxxx@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 9:00 AM
>> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
>> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>>
>> I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).
>>
>> Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies
>> would
>> be able to follow it.
>>
>> -pro
>>
>>
>> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis < xxxxx@microsoft.commailto:>> xxxxx@microsoft.com>> wrote:
>> Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver
>> development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my
>> findings.
>> This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will benefit
>> from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a blog.
>> I
>> don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as
>> “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time
>> and
>> new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.
>>
>> Just to answer a few of your questions, though:
>>
>> My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing
>> resources” (
>> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx
>> ).
>> Over there I have links to articles like
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started writing
>> device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233
>> (The
>> Basics: Exactly what is a driver).
>>
>> I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll
>> find
>> the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.
>>
>> Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide
>> links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting
>> material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental
>> OS
>> concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In addition,
>> in
>> my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”)I provide
>> links
>> for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.
>>
>> So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and
>> afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the
>> following:
>>
>> post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
>> post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
>> posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources
>>
>> (that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth).
>> But
>> after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an
>> introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my
>> opinion on
>> driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and
>> different IDEs that are used by developers.
>>
>> Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make
>> my
>> blog better.
>>
>> Ilias
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com mailto:>> xxxxx@lists.osr.com>
>> [xxxxx@lists.osr.commailto:>> xxxxx@lists.osr.com>] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
>> xxxxx@gmail.commailto:xxxxx]
>> Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
>> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
>> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
>>
>> This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
>> sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog?A newbie with some
>> background might ask the following questions first -
>>
>> 1) What is a windows driver ?
>>
>> 2) Why do we need a driver ?
>>
>> 3) What is the form of the binary file?
>>
>> 4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?
>>
>> 5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?
>>
>> 6) Where can I get my hands dirty?
>>
>> 7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?
>>
>> 8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are there
>> many or just one stucture?
>>
>> 9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS
>> concepts:
>> re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch.
>> inherently
>> threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.
>>
>> 10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc.
>> can perhaps be suggested.
>>
>> Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to
>> look
>> at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern
>> lifestyle.
>> THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -
>>
>> Introduction
>> Chronology
>> Comprehension
>> Completeness
>> Closing.
>>
>> None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads
>> it.
>> He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.
>>
>> Just a thought.
>>
>> -pro
>>
>>
>> On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis >> xxxxx@microsoft.com><mailto: xxxxx>>> xxxxx@microsoft.com>>> wrote:
>> I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while learning
>> about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
>> Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is
>> that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff, before
>> starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without
>> creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should
>> understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals,
>> Fourth
>> Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows
>> 2000” by
>> Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text)
>> and
>> then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about
>> “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (
>> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx),
>> “Introductory driver writing resources” (
>> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx)
>> and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (
>> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx)
>> interesting.
>>
>> Ilias
>>
>> —
>> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the
>> List
>> Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> —
>> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the
>> List
>> Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> —
>> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the
>> List
>> Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
>> —
>> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
>> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
>> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>>
></mailto:></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:></mailto:></mailto:>

Thank Don,

It surely is a news to me.

Would be waiting to grab a copy.

-pro

On 3/10/07, Don Burn wrote:
>
> Prokash,
>
> The OSR book maybe delayed but Microsoft Press will have a book by the
> WDF team out next month. See
> http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/books/10512.aspx
>
>
> –
> Don Burn (MVP, Windows DDK)
> Windows 2k/XP/2k3 Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Website: http://www.windrvr.com
> Blog: http://msmvps.com/blogs/WinDrvr
> Remove StopSpam to reply
>
> “Prokash Sinha” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
> > That would just be fantastic :-).
> >
> > Someday I would either start crying out very loud or start becoming
> > violent
> > if the WDF book from osr does not comeout anytime soon :-). I know all
> > osr-giants are very very busy, but how long should we wait ???.
> >
> > -pro
> >
> >
> >
> > On 3/10/07, Doron Holan wrote:
> >>
> >> FYI, my blog is going to start focusing a bit more on WDF design
> >> patterns
> >> as well over the course of the coming months
> >>
> >> d
> >>
> >>
> >> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:
> >> xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha
> >> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 11:52 AM
> >> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> >> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
> >>
> >> Absolutely.
> >>
> >> I would also appreciate if you could revamp the questions by adding
> >> and/or
> >> modifying whatever way you like. Please keep in mind that it should be
> >> useful to novice or newbies, so that they could learn as well as refer
> >> to it
> >> whenever they feel like. ( As an example: I would like to visit this
> >> blog
> >> once a while, since it does have some good links :slight_smile:
> >>
> >> Also I would like to see ( of course if the time permits :), different
> >> forms /patterns/structures of different types of windows drivers. I’m
> >> neither familiar with kmdf nor umdf, but if I look at the base WDM
> there
> >> are
> >> different structures for some major different types of drivers,
> >> including
> >> file system and file filters. And there are more callbacks type
> >> framework
> >> today than it used to be in nt 3.1 / 3.5 time. So I’m not sure if you
> >> already have links to channel 9 where for example some nice talks of (
> >> Neal,
> >> Molly, and Nar ) that gives a very nice introductory coverage of filter
> >> manager, cache manager and i/o architecure.
> >>
> >> I may be over-optimistic, but recently I have seen some people started
> >> working in file systems without any windows driver background, and it
> is
> >> hard for almost anyone in that shoe
. - And I call this M&M syndrom
> :-).
> >> Almost everyone loves to buy and / or eat it.BTW, M&M == Marketing &
> >> Management.
> >>
> >> -pro
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis wrote:
> >> Do I have your permission to use your list of questions in my next
> post?
> >> I
> >> was thinking of writing a post with the questions and where they can be
> >> found in the blog.
> >>
> >> Ilias
> >>
> >>
> >>

> >> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> >> [xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
> >> xxxxx@gmail.com]
> >> Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 9:00 AM
> >> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> >> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
> >>
> >> I did not have doubt about its usefulness :-).
> >>
> >> Now that you did the indexing ( by detailing in this note ), newbies
> >> would
> >> be able to follow it.
> >>
> >> -pro
> >>
> >>
> >> On 3/10/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis < xxxxx@microsoft.commailto:> >> xxxxx@microsoft.com>> wrote:
> >> Thanks for reading my blog. I am still a newbie in windows driver
> >> development and this blog is just a way for me to write down my
> >> findings.
> >> This is how I approached things and I hope that more people will
> benefit
> >> from that. Indeed, it’s hard to keep organizational structure in a
> blog.
> >> I
> >> don’t think that it’s easy for a blog to have what you describe as
> >> “beginning - middle - end” just because the blog evolves through time
> >> and
> >> new information that doesn’t fit in that model comes up.
> >>
> >> Just to answer a few of your questions, though:
> >>
> >> My 4th post has the title with the title “Introductory driver writing
> >> resources” (
> >>
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx
> >> ).
> >> Over there I have links to articles like
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=20 (Getting started
> writing
> >> device drivers) and http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?article=233
> >> (The
> >> Basics: Exactly what is a driver).
> >>
> >> I’m sure that if somebody looks just at the links in that post, he’ll
> >> find
> >> the answers to most of the questions that you are mentioning.
> >>
> >> Also, in my 2nd post (“Prerequisites for a driver developer”) I provide
> >> links to undergraduate courses with recorded lectures (and supporting
> >> material) on operating systems that answer questions about fundamental
> >> OS
> >> concepts. I guess that this would answer your 9th question. In
> addition,
> >> in
> >> my 3rd post (“Becoming familiar with the windows internals”)I provide
> >> links
> >> for the same concepts, as they are applied to Windows.
> >>
> >> So, generally, if you follow the structure of my blog from post 2 and
> >> afterwards (post 1 is an introduction for me), then you’ll see the
> >> following:
> >>
> >> post 2: Fundamental operating system concepts
> >> post 3: The previous concepts applied to windows
> >> posts 4,5: Really introductory driver writing resources
> >>
> >> (that’s where all your questions should have been answered in depth).
> >> But
> >> after that I also have posts with resources that can be used as an
> >> introduction to WDM, WDF, UMDF, KMDF. Subsequent posts provide my
> >> opinion on
> >> driver development books (your 10th question) and cover debugging and
> >> different IDEs that are used by developers.
> >>
> >> Thanks a lot for the criticism. I appreciate it and it’ll help me make
> >> my
> >> blog better.
> >>
> >> Ilias
> >>
> >> ________________________________________
> >> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com mailto:> >> xxxxx@lists.osr.com>
> >> [xxxxx@lists.osr.commailto:> >> xxxxx@lists.osr.com>] On Behalf Of Prokash Sinha [
> >> xxxxx@gmail.commailto:xxxxx]
> >> Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 7:54 PM
> >> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> >> Subject: Re: Re:[ntdev] Re: Beginner guide…
> >>
> >> This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
> >> sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog?A newbie with some
> >> background might ask the following questions first -
> >>
> >> 1) What is a windows driver ?
> >>
> >> 2) Why do we need a driver ?
> >>
> >> 3) What is the form of the binary file?
> >>
> >> 4) How they get installed/removed/ get executed?
> >>
> >> 5) Why it is different from ( usr-mode binaries: exe, dll )?
> >>
> >> 6) Where can I get my hands dirty?
> >>
> >> 7) What tools I need to develop/debug a driver ?
> >>
> >> 8) Are there any form or structure of a windows driver? If so, are
> there
> >> many or just one stucture?
> >>
> >> 9) Now once they found those, the next level comes with some OS
> >> concepts:
> >> re-entrant code, synchronization, interruptions, sync vs. asynch.
> >> inherently
> >> threaded, Irql levels and implications etc.
> >>
> >> 10) Finally they arrive at a point when the books / online sources etc.
> >> can perhaps be suggested.
> >>
> >> Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to
> >> look
> >> at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern
> >> lifestyle.
> >> THought very interesting, then found lack of all the following -
> >>
> >> Introduction
> >> Chronology
> >> Comprehension
> >> Completeness
> >> Closing.
> >>
> >> None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads
> >> it.
> >> He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.
> >>
> >> Just a thought.
> >>
> >> -pro
> >>
> >>
> >> On 3/9/07, Ilias Tsigkogiannis > >> xxxxx@microsoft.com><mailto: xxxxx>> >> xxxxx@microsoft.com>>> wrote:
> >> I’ve tried to write down the steps that I’ve been taking, while
> learning
> >> about device drivers at my blog at http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/
> >> Check it out and you might find it interesting. My approach, though, is
> >> that you need to start more by looking at more fundamental stuff,
> before
> >> starting to develop drivers (you can’t start building a house without
> >> creating solid foundations first, right?). First of all you should
> >> understand windows internals (the book “Microsoft Windows Internals,
> >> Fourth
> >> Edition: Microsoft Windows Server™ 2003, Windows XP, and Windows
> >> 2000” by
> >> Mark Russinovich and David Solomon is considered the definitive text)
> >> and
> >> then start building on top of that. You might find my first posts about
> >> “Becoming familiar with the windows internals” (
> >>
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/28/Becoming-familiar-with-the-windows-internals.aspx
> ),
> >> “Introductory driver writing resources” (
> >>
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/09/29/Introductory-driver-writing-resources.aspx
> )
> >> and “Windows Device Drivers Book Reviews” (
> >>
> http://blogs.msdn.com/iliast/archive/2006/10/25/Windows-Device-Drivers-Book-Reviews.aspx
> )
> >> interesting.
> >>
> >> Ilias
> >>
> >> —
> >> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
> >>
> >> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the
> >> List
> >> Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >> —
> >> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
> >>
> >> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the
> >> List
> >> Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >> —
> >> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
> >>
> >> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >> — Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256 To unsubscribe, visit the
> >> List
> >> Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >> —
> >> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
> >>
> >> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> >> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
> >>
> >
>
>
>
> —
> Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
> http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
></mailto:></mailto:xxxxx></mailto:></mailto:></mailto:>

Prokash Sinha wrote:

This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some
background might ask the following questions first -

Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to
look at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern
lifestyle. THought very interesting, then found lack of all the
following -

Introduction
Chronology
Comprehension
Completeness
Closing.

None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads
it. He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to him.

In my opinion, your expectations are unreasonable for a blog. Now, if
one were creating an educational website, or a collection of white
papers for instructional purposes, then what you’re saying is perfectly
applicable. But a blog is, virtually by definition, a disconnected
series of articles based loosely on some central theme.


Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

seconded

>> xxxxx@probo.com 2007-03-12 12:45 >>>
Prokash Sinha wrote:
This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with
some
background might ask the following questions first -

Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to
look at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and
modern
lifestyle. THought very interesting, then found lack of all the
following -

Introduction
Chronology
Comprehension
Completeness
Closing.

None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone
reads
it. He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to
him.

In my opinion, your expectations are unreasonable for a blog. Now, if
one were creating an educational website, or a collection of white
papers for instructional purposes, then what you’re saying is
perfectly
applicable. But a blog is, virtually by definition, a disconnected
series of articles based loosely on some central theme.


Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.


Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

I understand that it is by definition / assumption / convention a
disconnected blobs of information. But by simply looking at this blog, I
realized it does have quite a bit of informations that could be helpful. I
also don’t expect it to be well structured like a book. There are plenty of
books on this subject for newbies, and there are some excellent seminars on
this too. But if a proper indexing is done ( as the blog owner intended to
do :), it could be a valuable reference for newbies also. Quite frankly, it
is somewhat a new type, and the blog has quite a bit of links that can be
indexed to point to the right discussion. You all can argue that if one
needs (s)he can look at the ddk related sites and look thru the articles,
pick and choose. And my point would be, “look this blog is trying to
explain what’s ahead, and referring to some topics in a somewhat scattered
manner”, can we index it so that — a few links would lay out the basics ,
yet antoher few would layout wdm guts, and yet other few would layout the
kmdf guts … and so on.

Finally, I’m in no position to tell a newbie that first you take a seminar,
then grab some books, then look at this or that website. It depends on the
person at hand. Since this blog claims to help newbie, it is merely a
suggestion.

I was also thinking to have a blog on something related to programming, and
just started out. I see how hard it is to get my thoughts together. It is
just a start, eventually I will try to hit some of the grounds where some
experts could come suggest something.

If you want to “whack on my head”, here is the url. I would really really
appreciate if experianced people could comment on this in the future.

http://prokash.squarespace.com

-pro

On 3/12/07, Tim Roberts wrote:
>
> Prokash Sinha wrote:
> > This blog of yours have a lot of informations, but where is the
> > sturcture?. How would a newbie fly thru this blog? A newbie with some
> > background might ask the following questions first -
> > …
> > Recently I bumped into a friend’s blog ( actually he suggested me to
> > look at :-). He was writing somehting about computer chess and modern
> > lifestyle. THought very interesting, then found lack of all the
> > following -
> >
> > Introduction
> > Chronology
> > Comprehension
> > Completeness
> > Closing.
> >
> > None of them actually were existed, and brain hurts when someone reads
> > it. He is now rehashing the topics after I did send a violent note to
> him.
>
> In my opinion, your expectations are unreasonable for a blog. Now, if
> one were creating an educational website, or a collection of white
> papers for instructional purposes, then what you’re saying is perfectly
> applicable. But a blog is, virtually by definition, a disconnected
> series of articles based loosely on some central theme.
>
> –
> Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
> Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.
>
>
> —
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