If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE...

NTDEV
1

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d continue
to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

2

F1 help would work if MSDN included the DDK help files in the MSDN library.

Mark Roddy
xxxxx@hollistech.com
www.hollistech.com
603 321 1032
WindowsNT Windows 2000 Consulting Services

-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 11:17 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d continue
to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@stratus.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

3

I would love to see it and use.
I don’t care much about implementation details (like run BUILD or use nmake
or run cl directly or whatever) and tell me why should I care?
I also don’t care about a) and c) I do care, though, about b) In fact, if b)
is not supported I wouldn’t use this “intergration”.
What is messing?
Well, the biggest PITA for me right now is that I can’t build my drivers for
four different platforms (NT, W2K, XP-32 and XP-64) wrom one single instance
of DevStudio. And, of course, I would love to see this feature.
Another thing is that in my projects I have multiple subprojects (libraries)
and I can’t combine them in one targed project (like for SDK builds)
That’s it so far…

Best regards,

Vladimir

P.S. Yeah! I’m using (slightly modified, though) NuMega’s DevStudio
intergration.
P.P.S Are you, guys, into that?

-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 8:17 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d continue
to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@Starbase.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

4

Hmm. That sounds suspiciously like a license to (or a knockoff of)
ddkbuild. If it isn’t a *requirement* that it be used, it isn’t going to
get in the way of those who insist that they know better, and it will be a
“documented” way of doing it for those who are just getting into the field.
I don’t see a downside. For all of us who are already doing it this way,
there’s no change, so it’s a NOP for us.

Phil

-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 8:17 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d continue
to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@intel.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

5

You can build for all those platforms from a single instance of DevStudio
using DDKBuild. I’m using it to do Win9X, WinNT, and Win2K from the same
DevStudio project. When we finally move our target to XP, I’ll install the
DDK and add Checked and Free configurations for it, and I’ll be ready to go.

Item b is actually a function of the presence or absence of the DDK docs in
the MSDN Library. There isn’t any technical reason for it not to be there,
but it isn’t there, at least in the January 2001 edition.

Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: Chtchetkine, Vladimir [mailto:xxxxx@Starbase.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 8:48 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] RE: If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I would love to see it and use.
I don’t care much about implementation details (like run BUILD or use nmake
or run cl directly or whatever) and tell me why should I care?

I also don’t care about a) and c) I do care, though, about b) In fact, if b)
is not supported I wouldn’t use this “intergration”.

What is messing?
Well, the biggest PITA for me right now is that I can’t build my drivers for
four different platforms (NT, W2K, XP-32 and XP-64) wrom one single instance
of DevStudio. And, of course, I would love to see this feature.

Another thing is that in my projects I have multiple subprojects (libraries)
and I can’t combine them in one targed project (like for SDK builds)

That’s it so far…

Best regards,

Vladimir

P.S. Yeah! I’m using (slightly modified, though) NuMega’s DevStudio
intergration.
P.P.S Are you, guys, into that?

-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Viscarola [mailto:xxxxx@osr.com mailto:xxxxx]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 8:17 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d continue

to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

—
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@Starbase.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

—
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@intel.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

—
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com</mailto:xxxxx>

6

I use srctodsp.exe from NuMega. Tweaking the dsp to work with 2000 and
whistler is a real no-brainer.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com]On Behalf Of Peter Viscarola
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 8:17 AM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the
DDK) that ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words,
you’d continue
to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@storagecraft.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

7

For me, build.exe is quite sufficient tools and there is no need for further
supported method. I’m affraid ms would produce even more unnecessary
nonsense as vccheck in setenv.bat. No, thanks, the simplest is the best. The
clear simple method how to build a driver allows to customize build
environment as necessary. As Peter said in another mail:

“Every worker should be able to choose the tools they wish to use to do a
job.”

It is very easy to write a simple batch which calls build and use it from
any IDE or programmers editor. I really don’t understand where is a problem
for driver developer to write something like this. If one is too lazy, use
Mark Roddy’s solution. I personaly don’t use MSVC, Peter below wrote the
reasons why there is no advantage for driver development (comparing to other
editors, of course). Instead, I use programmers editor which has no problem
with, for example, context sensitive help for DDK. Also, work there is much
more effective, MSVC editor is inferior. Anyway, it is personal choice.

Build isn’t ideal because adds own “intelligency” which causes problems in
some cases. For example it isn’t possible to address parent subdirectories
(i.e. …\subdir\file.c) in SOURCES. I would prefer nmake but build is still
useful. There is only problem: documentation. There are too many
undocumented useful switches (as BROWSER_INFO) and only docs is
makefile.def. It isn’t too easy to read it and if one find something useful,
there is no certainty then it won’t change in next DDK version. It isn’t so
big problem but seems to stop many developers from advantages as symbol
browser (currently, I can’t imagine work without it).

Imagine ms cease build and the only supported method for building drivers is
a msvc wizard. Nightmare. Praise build :slight_smile:

Best regards,

Michal Vodicka
Veridicom
(RKK - Skytale)
[WWW: http://www.veridicom.com , http://www.skytale.com]

From: Peter Viscarola[SMTP:xxxxx@osr.com]
Reply To: NT Developers Interest List
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 5:17 PM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.

Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that
ran
BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)

Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?

Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
way you do for SDK functions
b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
function, the way you do for SDK functions
c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d
continue
to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
please do let me know what you think…

Peter
OSR

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@rkk.cz
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

8

The only use I have for VC++ in building a driver is that if I also cause a
browse file to be built (and I understand that one can DDKBUILD to build
browse files and that in fact I could use “command window” build to produce
a browse file), I can open the source for a file, right-click on a variable
or type and select “show where defined”: This is a time-saver in finding
definitions.

Another possible use (but one I’m not interested in) is that compilation
errors (and warnings) in VC++ are listed in the little window at the
bottom, and one can click on an error and the editor takes one to the point
of the error (as best the compiler understood it, anyway).

James Antognini
IBM Research

Internet address – antognini@us.ibm.com
Notes address – James Antognini/Watson/xxxxx@IBMUS

Phone – external: 914-784-7258; tieline: 863-7258

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

9

(Mr. Viscarola posts his messages in a VERY strange way - I cannot reply to
them directly and forced to create a brand new message and copy the text
there using the clipboard. I have Outlook Express 5.5, and it cannot send
the reply due to some error message box.
The icon for his messages is also different from the other messages icons.)

Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
within the IDE?

  1. Auto-go to the offending source line on double click in the build output
    window
  2. The browser database
  3. The VC6’s auto-complete feature
  4. The F1 context sensitive help.

These are ALL differences between building from IDE or from BUILD.EXE.

Max

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

10

> “documented” way of doing it for those who are just getting into the
field.

Create your own DSP project and use the same compiler and linker command
line options there as BUILD uses. This will work.

Max

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

11

> -----Original Message-----

From: Maxim S. Shatskih [mailto:xxxxx@storagecraft.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 2:45 PM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Re: If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

[snip]

> Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably
using the DDK
> within the IDE?

  1. Auto-go to the offending source line on double click in
    the build output
    window
  2. The browser database

This is correct. You can get these either by meticulously twiddling the
settings on the compiler and linker to create the driver the same as build,
or you can use DDKBuild.bat, and get these features in a few minutes,
instead of an hour or more.

  1. The VC6’s auto-complete feature

Not for DDK functions and data structures, which is what we are discussing
here. If you know of a way to enable auto-complete on DDK functions and
structs, please post a procedure. You will be a hero to a lot of people.

  1. The F1 context sensitive help.

Not for DDK functions. The only way to do this is to hack the MSDNXXX.COL
file to include the DDK doc files. Not pretty, and not recommended.

Phil

* Philip D. Barila | (503) 264-8386
* Intel Corp. | M/S JF2-53 Office JF2-2-G6
* Storage Architecture and Performance
* Internet Systems Lab

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

12

> Another possible use (but one I’m not interested in) is that compilation

errors (and warnings) in VC++ are listed in the little window at the
bottom

No!
I hate docked windows and use the full-screen Output window.
:-)))

Max

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

13

So don’t use them. I use the heck out of them.

:slight_smile:

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Maxim S. Shatskih [mailto:xxxxx@storagecraft.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 4:20 PM
To: NT Developers Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Re: If MS Supported Building Drivers
From The IDE…

Another possible use (but one I’m not interested in) is
that compilation
> errors (and warnings) in VC++ are listed in the little
window at the
> bottom

No!
I hate docked windows and use the full-screen Output window.
:-)))

Max

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as:
xxxxx@delphieng.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to
leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

14

>Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method

for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE).

I thought Microsoft was supposed to try and keep the OS part of the company
unattached from the application part. I assume MSVC is an application.

My trust of the OS group getting things “correct” is also a bit higher than
that of the MSVC group (think about the incredible DLL version conflicts
created by the MSVC group).

I’d not be in favor of the DDK group expecting the MSVC group to deliver
appropriate tools for kernel development. On the contrary, I think the
budget for kernel tool development should be increased, to the point of
being able to deliver extremely high quality tools DESIGNED for kernel use.

I can remember times in the past when it was IMPOSSIBLE to purchase the
correct version of MSVC to go along with kernel development, as MSVC had
been updated and the OS/DDK hadn’t. It was pretty ugly to explain to
consulting clients who were trying to get setup to do driver development
that the only way to get the correct tools was for me (or somebody) to let
them use an old version of MSVC, after they bought the new useless version
of MSVC. I don’t have to remind many of you what problems there were when
MSVC changed it’s symbol format, to be incompatible with the available
kernel debugger.

I think creating DISTANCE between incompatible environments (Win32 vs.
kernel) might make things easier for newer kernel developers. Has anybody
noticed how often questions come up here that are like “I tried to link my
driver with MFC string classes and it doesn’t work, what am I doing wrong”.
There is also some fuzzy area of user mode driver thingy’s that are very
unclear. For example, the DirectShow filter classes seem to have there own
universe. It’s hard to say if these things are “drivers”. I think it would
also be real useful to split out the “legacy” way of doing something, from
the current “correct” way. If the docs and includes didn’t talk about
things so intertwined, perhaps developers would find things easier. Of
course this would require Microsoft being clear about how things have
evolved, and how older code (which might still sortof execute) is really
not supported anymore.

If we fully buy into the .NET architecture, then it seems like MOST user
mode code from the past is on the track to being obsolete. My belief is
developers can’t forever integrate old and new architectures, all in the
same soup. A perfect example is comparing NT 4 drivers to W2K. There often
isn’t really a way to make your NT 4 driver be an appropriate W2K driver.

  • Jan

You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

15

I would use the support. I’ve used and sometimes struggled
with ddkbuild since long before OSR published it.

As far as the limitations, I believe the first two are compiler problems
that should be fixed by Microsoft:

  1. IntelliSense should have a way (preferably a pragma)
    to allow parameter completion from function prototypes
    (see KB article Q190974 for an explanation of why
    the DDK functions don’t autocomplete). For that matter
    there should be a way to disable the auto completion of
    functions you don’t include!

  2. F1 help, this is because of Microsoft’s friggin the Web
    is everything mentality. The DDK should be part of MSDN
    documentation. For that matter the compiler should allow
    additional help files be indexed, so that one can even do for
    their own functions.

Don Burn
Windows 2000 Device Driver and Filesystem consulting

----- Original Message -----
From: “Peter Viscarola”
Newsgroups: ntdev
To: “NT Developers Interest List”
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 11:17 AM
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

> I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.
>
> Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
> for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
> that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that
ran
> BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
> command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)
>
> Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?
>
> Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
> a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
> way you do for SDK functions
> b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
> function, the way you do for SDK functions
> c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d
continue
> to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.
>
> Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
> within the IDE?
>
> Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
> please do let me know what you think…
>
> Peter
> OSR
>
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@acm.org
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

—
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

16

Well, I always edit drivers with the IDE, then build them to
get rid of compilation errors, and to get browse info. I’d then
rebuild using the standard tools to get a binary that I can use.
I’ve always been too lazy to make the IDE generate the binary.

I would be extremely happy to always use the IDE, and to not set it up
by hand each time.
-DH

PS. I’ve always been confused as to why they didn’t use the IDE’s debugger which is a real product vs. the buggy unsupported
WinDbg, but one step at a time.

----- Original Message -----
From: “Peter Viscarola”
Newsgroups: ntdev
To: “NT Developers Interest List”
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2001 11:17 AM
Subject: [ntdev] If MS Supported Building Drivers From The IDE…

> I have a hypothetical for the members of this list.
>
> Imagine Microsoft were to provide, as part of the DDK, a supported method
> for building drivers from within Visual Studio (the IDE). Further imagine
> that this method was to execute a bat file (provided with the DDK) that ran
> BUILD as an external build step. (And, of course, using BUILD from the
> command line as we do today would still be a supported option.)
>
> Tell me: Would you care? Would you view it as a good and useful thing?
>
> Would it be a good and useful thing, even though:
> a) You did not get support for “function expansion” for DDK functions, the
> way you do for SDK functions
> b) You did not get support for hitting F1 and getting help on a DDK
> function, the way you do for SDK functions
> c) You could not debug from within the IDE – In other words, you’d continue
> to use your favorite debugger, such as WinDbg, the way we do now.
>
> Or are any/some/all of the above requisites to profitably using the DDK
> within the IDE?
>
> Feedback to the list or directly to me… your choice. But by all means
> please do let me know what you think…
>
> Peter
> OSR
>
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: xxxxx@syssoftsol.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com

—
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: $subst(‘Recip.EmailAddr’)
To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ntdev-$subst(‘Recip.MemberIDChar’)@lists.osr.com