File-based file system?

NTFSD
1

I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been doing C/C++
programming for 20 years including some simple UNIX drivers some years
back.

I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar to “tar” or
“WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only file system that allows
access to the contents of this “archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95,
98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.

How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I start researching
how to approach this? What software am I likely to find useful in
approaching this task?

I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.

Thanks,
Dave

2

Consider writing a shell namespace extension instead of a full-fledged
filesystem. This is what you see when you right-click on a Winzip
archive from explorer and choose ‘explore’.

  • Nicholas Ryan

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David A. Myers
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 1:15 PM
To: File Systems Developers
Subject: [ntfsd] File-based file system?

I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been
doing C/C++ programming for 20 years including some simple
UNIX drivers some years back.

I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar
to “tar” or “WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only
file system that allows access to the contents of this
“archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.

How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I
start researching how to approach this? What software am I
likely to find useful in approaching this task?

I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.

Thanks,
Dave

You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@nryan.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%

3

Very, since FS in Windows in general are not all that well documented in the
public. Expect a learning curve of a couple months and spending quite a bit
of money on tools. You’ll spend another couple months figuring things out
without proper tools.
I personally think VxDs were easier to write than NT based file systems, but
I had a asm framework to work off of.
My first monitoring filter driver took well over a month to get up and
running without significant bugs.
Look up Bo Branten’s projects on the web, he’s got something similar to what
you’re proposing. Caveat emptor, I found the code marginally well
documented. (hey, it’s free)

Will

----- Original Message -----
From: “David A. Myers”
To: “File Systems Developers”
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 1:14 PM
Subject: [ntfsd] File-based file system?

> I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been doing C/C++
> programming for 20 years including some simple UNIX drivers some years
> back.
>
> I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar to “tar” or
> “WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only file system that allows
> access to the contents of this “archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95,
> 98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.
>
> How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I start researching
> how to approach this? What software am I likely to find useful in
> approaching this task?
>
> I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.
>
> Thanks,
> Dave
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@figure8.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>

4

If he really wants to write a filesystem in less than two man years, he will
need the IFS Kit from Microsoft. I would also recommend spending about
$100,000 for the FileSystems Kit from OSR. I have never seen the kit, but I
have taken their classes and I have done filesystem work, so I know how
much trouble it can be. Read-Only filesystems are a real pain sometimes,
e.g. NTFS. I suspect that with the kits and a “little” consulting,
something can be done in a few months.

I am suggesting this, not as the best solution to a particular problem, but
just in case the filesystem driver is a non-negotiable part of the solution.
Sometimes marketing just wants - regardless of the best solution.

----- Original Message -----
From: “Nicholas Ryan”
To: “File Systems Developers”
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 4:47 PM
Subject: [ntfsd] RE: File-based file system?

> Consider writing a shell namespace extension instead of a full-fledged
> filesystem. This is what you see when you right-click on a Winzip
> archive from explorer and choose ‘explore’.
>
> - Nicholas Ryan
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> > [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David A. Myers
> > Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 1:15 PM
> > To: File Systems Developers
> > Subject: [ntfsd] File-based file system?
> >
> >
> > I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been
> > doing C/C++ programming for 20 years including some simple
> > UNIX drivers some years back.
> >
> > I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar
> > to “tar” or “WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only
> > file system that allows access to the contents of this
> > “archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.
> >
> > How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I
> > start researching how to approach this? What software am I
> > likely to find useful in approaching this task?
> >
> > I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Dave
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@nryan.com
> > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
> >
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@yoshimuni.com
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>

5

An “archive file” explorer can be done whithout any file system work. So pls
guys, dont scare this guy too much. He dont need any FS or FSF for what he
wants to write. Nor he needs to spend thousands of US$ for this, explorer
extensions are way way cheaper.

Regards, Dan

----- Original Message -----
From: “David J. Craig”
To: “File Systems Developers”
Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 12:26 AM
Subject: [ntfsd] RE: File-based file system?

> If he really wants to write a filesystem in less than two man years, he
will
> need the IFS Kit from Microsoft. I would also recommend spending about
> $100,000 for the FileSystems Kit from OSR. I have never seen the kit, but
I
> have taken their classes and I have done filesystem work, so I know how
> much trouble it can be. Read-Only filesystems are a real pain sometimes,
> e.g. NTFS. I suspect that with the kits and a “little” consulting,
> something can be done in a few months.
>
> I am suggesting this, not as the best solution to a particular problem,
but
> just in case the filesystem driver is a non-negotiable part of the
solution.
> Sometimes marketing just wants - regardless of the best solution.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: “Nicholas Ryan”
> To: “File Systems Developers”
> Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 4:47 PM
> Subject: [ntfsd] RE: File-based file system?
>
>
> > Consider writing a shell namespace extension instead of a full-fledged
> > filesystem. This is what you see when you right-click on a Winzip
> > archive from explorer and choose ‘explore’.
> >
> > - Nicholas Ryan
> >
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> > > [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David A. Myers
> > > Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 1:15 PM
> > > To: File Systems Developers
> > > Subject: [ntfsd] File-based file system?
> > >
> > >
> > > I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been
> > > doing C/C++ programming for 20 years including some simple
> > > UNIX drivers some years back.
> > >
> > > I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar
> > > to “tar” or “WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only
> > > file system that allows access to the contents of this
> > > “archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.
> > >
> > > How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I
> > > start researching how to approach this? What software am I
> > > likely to find useful in approaching this task?
> > >
> > > I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Dave
> > >
> > > —
> > > You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@nryan.com
> > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > —
> > You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@yoshimuni.com
> > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
> >
>
>
>
>
> —
> You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@rdsor.ro
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>

6

Namespace/shell extensions are not always that powerfull (usefull) as a
file system since regular file system API (except for browsing) that all
Win32 applications use is not available for working with those types
files. So, the answer really depends on the use case. What’s the purpose
of the system?

7

Hi, David,

Although there is still a significant number of 9x/Me users, I believe
it would be much better and easier if you just made a Windows NT/2K/XP file
system or file system filter.
The one thing that I think will make this a very hard adventure is the
archive requirements, e.g. quite a lot of memory is required (compared t
typical driver requirements, that is), and possibly stack space limitations -
the stack is limited to 8-16KB (depending on the NT platform, or 4K on 9x,
even), and if your code previously used the stack - you’d need to do a lot of
rewriting and retesting.
Finally - I would recommend doing a shell extension. It’s certainly
easier and fully documented in the Windows SDK.
Or - get Bo Branten’s File Disk - I don’t know the URL, sorry. That
sample should tell you how to make a file system for your purposes easily,
since it does implement FS in a file. I have some source code for a 9x file
system in a file, and if you wish I can e-mail it to you.
Consider writing a file system filter instead of a file system,
though… it might be more interesting to you, with similar functionality, and
certainly less work.

“David A. Myers” wrote:

I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been doing C/C++
programming for 20 years including some simple UNIX drivers some years
back.

I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar to “tar” or
“WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only file system that allows
access to the contents of this “archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95,
98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.

How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I start researching
how to approach this? What software am I likely to find useful in
approaching this task?

I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.

Thanks,
Dave

You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@alfasp.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%

Regards, Dejan.

“David A. Myers” wrote:

I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been doing C/C++
programming for 20 years including some simple UNIX drivers some years back.

I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar to “tar” or
“WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only file system that allows
access to the contents of this “archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95,
98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.

How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I start researching
how to approach this? What software am I likely to find useful in
approaching this task?

–
Kind regards, Dejan M. www.alfasp.com
E-mail: xxxxx@alfasp.com ICQ#: 56570367
Alfa File Monitor - File monitoring library for Win32 developers.
Alfa File Protector - File protection and hiding library for Win32 developers.

8

You probably didn’t test it then:-)
No filter driver is without bugs - the question is only how close to that
point did it get. Just look at all the AV software out there:-)

My first monitoring filter driver took well over a month to get up and running
without significant bugs.

–
Kind regards, Dejan M. www.alfasp.com
E-mail: xxxxx@alfasp.com ICQ#: 56570367
Alfa File Monitor - File monitoring library for Win32 developers.
Alfa File Protector - File protection and hiding library for Win32 developers.

9

I think he already thought abut that and wants a Filesystem. Not
everyone uses Explorer and
has therefore not the explorer namespace. Why? there’s a better more
mighty namespace:
The object manager’s namespace. Then the goal is a Fileystem Filter Driver.

David: Google for ex2 and NT and get yourself the opensource header
ntifs.h which allows you in
conjunction with a compiler and the ddk to write that kind of driver

Dan Partelly schrieb:

An “archive file” explorer can be done whithout any file system work. So pls
guys, dont scare this guy too much. He dont need any FS or FSF for what he
wants to write. Nor he needs to spend thousands of US$ for this, explorer
extensions are way way cheaper.

Regards, Dan

----- Original Message -----
From: “David J. Craig”
>To: “File Systems Developers”
>Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 12:26 AM
>Subject: [ntfsd] RE: File-based file system?
>
>
>
>
>>If he really wants to write a filesystem in less than two man years, he
>>
>>
>will
>
>
>>need the IFS Kit from Microsoft. I would also recommend spending about
>>$100,000 for the FileSystems Kit from OSR. I have never seen the kit, but
>>
>>
>I
>
>
>>have taken their classes and I have done filesystem work, so I know how
>>much trouble it can be. Read-Only filesystems are a real pain sometimes,
>>e.g. NTFS. I suspect that with the kits and a “little” consulting,
>>something can be done in a few months.
>>
>>I am suggesting this, not as the best solution to a particular problem,
>>
>>
>but
>
>
>>just in case the filesystem driver is a non-negotiable part of the
>>
>>
>solution.
>
>
>>Sometimes marketing just wants - regardless of the best solution.
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: “Nicholas Ryan”
>>To: “File Systems Developers”
>>Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 4:47 PM
>>Subject: [ntfsd] RE: File-based file system?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>Consider writing a shell namespace extension instead of a full-fledged
>>>filesystem. This is what you see when you right-click on a Winzip
>>>archive from explorer and choose ‘explore’.
>>>
>>>- Nicholas Ryan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>>>>[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of David A. Myers
>>>>Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 1:15 PM
>>>>To: File Systems Developers
>>>>Subject: [ntfsd] File-based file system?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I’m a neophyte to writing file systems, though I’ve been
>>>>doing C/C++ programming for 20 years including some simple
>>>>UNIX drivers some years back.
>>>>
>>>>I have some software that packages up a set of files (similar
>>>>to “tar” or “WinZip”). I would like to create a read-only
>>>>file system that allows access to the contents of this
>>>>“archive”. I’d like to support Windows 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, and XP.
>>>>
>>>>How difficult is this task likely to be? Where should I
>>>>start researching how to approach this? What software am I
>>>>likely to find useful in approaching this task?
>>>>
>>>>I’d appreciate any help or pointers that you provide.
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>Dave
>>>>
>>>>—
>>>>You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@nryan.com
>>>>To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>—
>>>You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@yoshimuni.com
>>>To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>—
>>You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@rdsor.ro
>>To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to ntfsd as: xxxxx@koepferl.de
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%%
>
>

10

Hi,

i remember a microsoft research project using a proxy-driver providing
an interface for creating filesystems in user mode. See
http://research.microsoft.com/~galenh/proxy/
for more info (don’t know about its status, however).

Also some informations may be found at http://www.acc.umu.se/~bosse/.
He Lists another user-mode filesystem for NT
(http://web.mit.edu/fifs/www/).

Greetings,

Holger

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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
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I think he already thought abut that and wants a Filesystem. Not
everyone uses Explorer and
has therefore not the explorer namespace. Why? there’s a better more
mighty namespace:
The object manager’s namespace. Then the goal is a Fileystem Filter Driver.

David: Google for ex2 and NT and get yourself the opensource header
ntifs.h which allows you in
conjunction with a compiler and the ddk to write that kind of driver

Dan Partelly schrieb: