I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver
development, and I have a question about Windows Update. Do checked OS
builds properly handle Windows Update? Should I simply never run WU on a
checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with
retail patch binaries?
Thanks.
– arlie
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver development, and I have?a question about Windows Update.? Do checked OS builds properly handle Windows Update?? Should I simply never run WU on a checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with retail patch binaries?
?
Thanks.
?
– arlie
?
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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What would happen on a free build system with just checked kernel and hal? I assume that since the filenames are different it would not overwrite the checked versions of those files with newer fre ones, but how would one go about getting any necessary updates for those checked files? What is the recommended method?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 7:53 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver development, and I have?a question about Windows Update.? Do checked OS builds properly handle Windows Update?? Should I simply never run WU on a checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with retail patch binaries?
?
Thanks.
?
– arlie
?
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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I don’t the depth of the fre/chk check (like if it is a call to GetSystemParameterInfo or a file ver check). One way to do this is is to have 2 entries on boot.ini. one is a normal fre install, the other is the same install and uses /kernel: and /hal: to use the chk versions for those files. When you want to go to WU, you just boot into the pure fre install
d
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Brown, Beverly
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 12:21 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
What would happen on a free build system with just checked kernel and hal? I assume that since the filenames are different it would not overwrite the checked versions of those files with newer fre ones, but how would one go about getting any necessary updates for those checked files? What is the recommended method?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 7:53 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver development, and I have?a question about Windows Update.? Do checked OS builds properly handle Windows Update?? Should I simply never run WU on a checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with retail patch binaries?
?
Thanks.
?
– arlie
?
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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Well, I was using a free build of XP, with kernel/HAL replaced, and that
works fine. But I wanted the additional checking that comes with having all
drivers loaded checked, and doing that with .kdfiles or overriding SFP was
just too much hassle and too unreliable.
Turns out, the checked build of XP does not deal with WU very well. It
downloads packages, then attempts to install them, but fails. It also fails
without giving the user any indication of *why* it failed. I understand
that the checked build is a special, not-for-users build, but this seems
like a big failing of WU – failing to report errors. But that has nothing
to do with NTDEV.
So, it appears impossible to patch a purely checked XP build, beyond SP2.
(At least MS provides a checked version of SP2.) That seems like a problem
to me.
– arlie
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Brown, Beverly
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 3:21 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
What would happen on a free build system with just checked kernel and hal? I
assume that since the filenames are different it would not overwrite the
checked versions of those files with newer fre ones, but how would one go
about getting any necessary updates for those checked files? What is the
recommended method?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 7:53 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I
don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver
development, and I have?a question about Windows Update.? Do checked OS
builds properly handle Windows Update?? Should I simply never run WU on a
checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with
retail patch binaries?
?
Thanks.
?
– arlie
?
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
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http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
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Actually it is better than it was, in the past WU would overwrite the
checked code with the retail code, sometimes with disasterous results. As I
said over a year ago (see
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/resources/MVP/xtremeMVP_giveup.mspx#EBAA) the
checked build is the Rodney Dangerfield of Redmond. This is really sad with
all the efforts to improve quality.
–
Don Burn (MVP, Windows DDK)
Windows 2k/XP/2k3 Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Remove StopSpam from the email to reply
“Arlie Davis” wrote in message
news:xxxxx@ntdev…
Well, I was using a free build of XP, with kernel/HAL replaced, and that
works fine. But I wanted the additional checking that comes with having all
drivers loaded checked, and doing that with .kdfiles or overriding SFP was
just too much hassle and too unreliable.
Turns out, the checked build of XP does not deal with WU very well. It
downloads packages, then attempts to install them, but fails. It also fails
without giving the user any indication of why it failed. I understand
that the checked build is a special, not-for-users build, but this seems
like a big failing of WU – failing to report errors. But that has nothing
to do with NTDEV.
So, it appears impossible to patch a purely checked XP build, beyond SP2.
(At least MS provides a checked version of SP2.) That seems like a problem
to me.
– arlie
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Brown, Beverly
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 3:21 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
What would happen on a free build system with just checked kernel and hal? I
assume that since the filenames are different it would not overwrite the
checked versions of those files with newer fre ones, but how would one go
about getting any necessary updates for those checked files? What is the
recommended method?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 7:53 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I
don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
________________________________________
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver
development, and I have a question about Windows Update. Do checked OS
builds properly handle Windows Update? Should I simply never run WU on a
checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with
retail patch binaries?
Thanks.
– arlie
—
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
—
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
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—
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
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“the checked build is the Rodney Dangerfield of Redmond” - That is
golden, I’m going to have to steal it…
Thanks for the laugh,
M
Don Burn wrote:
Actually it is better than it was, in the past WU would overwrite the
checked code with the retail code, sometimes with disasterous results. As I
said over a year ago (see
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/resources/MVP/xtremeMVP_giveup.mspx#EBAA) the
checked build is the Rodney Dangerfield of Redmond. This is really sad with
all the efforts to improve quality.
All right, that tears it. I like the idea of the checked build, but there
are just too many problems with it. I’m going to stick to .kdfiles for
pulling over selected checked binaries, and I’m going to re-re-install my
test boxes again.
There are so many assertion failures in user-mode Windows DLLs and EXEs that
I can’t even use a lot of Windows XP. Back to retail.
– arlie
I know a lot of people swear by the checked build but I personally hardly
ever use it. I find driver verifier and generous use of tracing and driver
assertions sufficient.
=====================
Mark Roddy DDK MVP
Windows 2003/XP/2000 Consulting
Hollis Technology Solutions 603-321-1032
www.hollistech.com
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 6:17 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows UpdateAll right, that tears it. I like the idea of the checked
build, but there are just too many problems with it. I’m
going to stick to .kdfiles for pulling over selected checked
binaries, and I’m going to re-re-install my test boxes again.There are so many assertion failures in user-mode Windows
DLLs and EXEs that I can’t even use a lot of Windows XP.
Back to retail.– arlie
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at
http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256You are currently subscribed to ntdev as:
xxxxx@hollistech.com To unsubscribe send a blank email to
xxxxx@lists.osr.com
Yes, but what about updates to the checked versions of the hal and kernel files themselves? If an update involves updating those files plus some other files, will there be a problem if there is a mismatch between the checked hal/kernel files (which did not get updated) and the other files in the patch that did? If so, how would a developer go about obtaining an update for the checked hal/kernel files?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 3:32 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I don’t the depth of the fre/chk check (like if it is a call to GetSystemParameterInfo or a file ver check). One way to do this is is to have 2 entries on boot.ini. one is a normal fre install, the other is the same install and uses /kernel: and /hal: to use the chk versions for those files. When you want to go to WU, you just boot into the pure fre install
d
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Brown, Beverly
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 12:21 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
What would happen on a free build system with just checked kernel and hal? I assume that since the filenames are different it would not overwrite the checked versions of those files with newer fre ones, but how would one go about getting any necessary updates for those checked files? What is the recommended method?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 7:53 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver development, and I have?a question about Windows Update.? Do checked OS builds properly handle Windows Update?? Should I simply never run WU on a checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with retail patch binaries?
?
Thanks.
?
– arlie
?
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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Sorry, I don’t know
d
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Brown, Beverly
Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 7:30 AM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Yes, but what about updates to the checked versions of the hal and kernel files themselves? If an update involves updating those files plus some other files, will there be a problem if there is a mismatch between the checked hal/kernel files (which did not get updated) and the other files in the patch that did? If so, how would a developer go about obtaining an update for the checked hal/kernel files?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 3:32 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I don’t the depth of the fre/chk check (like if it is a call to GetSystemParameterInfo or a file ver check). One way to do this is is to have 2 entries on boot.ini. one is a normal fre install, the other is the same install and uses /kernel: and /hal: to use the chk versions for those files. When you want to go to WU, you just boot into the pure fre install
d
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Brown, Beverly
Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 12:21 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
What would happen on a free build system with just checked kernel and hal? I assume that since the filenames are different it would not overwrite the checked versions of those files with newer fre ones, but how would one go about getting any necessary updates for those checked files? What is the recommended method?
Beverly
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Doron Holan
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 7:53 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: RE: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
Typically an fre update package will not install itself on a chk build. I don’t know if WU has both chk & fre update packages or not though.
d
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Arlie Davis
Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 3:09 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: [ntdev] Checked OS builds and Windows Update
I’m setting up several systems with checked OS builds for driver development, and I have?a question about Windows Update.? Do checked OS builds properly handle Windows Update?? Should I simply never run WU on a checked machine, since it would overwrite checked system binaries with retail patch binaries?
?
Thanks.
?
– arlie
?
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
Questions? First check the Kernel Driver FAQ at http://www.osronline.com/article.cfm?id=256
You are currently subscribed to ntdev as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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