Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

WINDBG
1

Hello,

I’ve question about windows boot and drivers loading during that phase.

Here is my case, I’ve moved a disk to a new system that has diff?rent hardware,
but that should support the physical drive moved. Then during the boot phase
I got a blue screen which strangely lasts only a fraction of a second…
I’m not able to look a the error codes…

I wanted to understand what could cause this issue and try to grasp the way
Windows uses the Plug and Play technology to recognize the hardware present(connected
to the motherboard) and the way it accomodates thoses changes…

In order to attempt a repair, I changed, based on several articles found
on the internet, a couple of keys in the registry using a tool called “ERD
Commander”. Those keys are related to PNP.

The first one, is under CriticalDataBase (which should in my understanding
match a VendoIR-ProductID to service and a driver component on disk). The
second one was under services in order add the relation with the PNP device
and to change the startup value to zero…Blue screen always here

Can anyone tell me how the PNP works on windows ? How the device is related
to the driver or drivers components (.sys,.dll) on the system ? Is the ENUM
key only generated at setup time and should also be modified to accomodate
the change ? How can I troubleshoot those things ?

Thanks in advance

Angelo

2

Hello,

Can anyone help me on this ? I think members of this list are the best people
around who can help me or at least redirect me to another ressource

Help really appeciated

Regards

Angelo

– Message original –
Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 12:54:36 +0100
From: xxxxx@bluewin.ch
Subject: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>
>
>
>Hello,
>
>I’ve question about windows boot and drivers loading during that phase.

>
>Here is my case, I’ve moved a disk to a new system that has diff?rent hardware,
>but that should support the physical drive moved. Then during the boot phase
>I got a blue screen which strangely lasts only a fraction of a second…
>I’m not able to look a the error codes…
>
>I wanted to understand what could cause this issue and try to grasp the
way
>Windows uses the Plug and Play technology to recognize the hardware present(connected
>to the motherboard) and the way it accomodates thoses changes…
>
>In order to attempt a repair, I changed, based on several articles found
>on the internet, a couple of keys in the registry using a tool called “ERD
>Commander”. Those keys are related to PNP.
>
>The first one, is under CriticalDataBase (which should in my understanding
>match a VendoIR-ProductID to service and a driver component on disk). The
>second one was under services in order add the relation with the PNP device
>and to change the startup value to zero…Blue screen always here
>
>
>Can anyone tell me how the PNP works on windows ? How the device is related
>to the driver or drivers components (.sys,.dll) on the system ? Is the ENUM
>key only generated at setup time and should also be modified to accomodate
>the change ? How can I troubleshoot those things ?
>
>Thanks in advance
>
>Angelo
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

3

Was this the boot disc you moved to become the boot disc for “different
hardware”? If not then possibly the BIOS is not seeing the disc and during
boot it is needed, or the BIOS thinks the moved disc is the boot disc.

If it is the boot disc then the operative words there are “new system that
has different hardware”. That MIGHT work if you go from a Latitude D610 to
another Latitude D610 built in the same year and lot number. The problem is
the “different hardware”, which the OS you moved knows nothing about, and
consequently tries to load wrong drivers. You are lucky you even got a BSOD.
You can image an existing HDD, replace it with a new HDD and then image the
new disc with the image you saved from the older disc, but moving an
existing OS disc to the boot disc of a new CPU is not likely to work.

In the latter case you need to at least run the install disc. You MIGHT be
able to affect a repair, but more than likely you will require a complete
install.

The personal opinion of
Gary G. Little

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@bluewin.ch
Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2006 10:14 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

Hello,

Can anyone help me on this ? I think members of this list are the best
people
around who can help me or at least redirect me to another ressource

Help really appeciated

Regards

Angelo

– Message original –
Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 12:54:36 +0100
From: xxxxx@bluewin.ch
Subject: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>
>
>
>Hello,
>
>I’ve question about windows boot and drivers loading during that phase.

>
>Here is my case, I’ve moved a disk to a new system that has diff?rent
hardware,
>but that should support the physical drive moved. Then during the boot
phase
>I got a blue screen which strangely lasts only a fraction of a second…
>I’m not able to look a the error codes…
>
>I wanted to understand what could cause this issue and try to grasp the
way
>Windows uses the Plug and Play technology to recognize the hardware
present(connected
>to the motherboard) and the way it accomodates thoses changes…
>
>In order to attempt a repair, I changed, based on several articles found
>on the internet, a couple of keys in the registry using a tool called “ERD
>Commander”. Those keys are related to PNP.
>
>The first one, is under CriticalDataBase (which should in my understanding
>match a VendoIR-ProductID to service and a driver component on disk). The
>second one was under services in order add the relation with the PNP device
>and to change the startup value to zero…Blue screen always here
>
>
>Can anyone tell me how the PNP works on windows ? How the device is related
>to the driver or drivers components (.sys,.dll) on the system ? Is the ENUM
>key only generated at setup time and should also be modified to accomodate
>the change ? How can I troubleshoot those things ?
>
>Thanks in advance
>
>Angelo
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

—
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4

It seems the move was not something that the OS likes and you should not be surprised.

I don’t know what kind of BSOD you are getting and what you did in ERD commander (not familiar with that software). But I would guess you are seeing a STOP 0x0000007B INACCESSIBLE_BOOT_DEVICE.

If you are then, I have personally never been able to get around it and have always had to install afresh. Some folks on the net seem to have found some solutions to their problems by following certain steps, but I would recommend caution before trusting these and of course backup everything so if you maim the install, you can say you tried.

Satya

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@bluewin.ch
Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2006 8:14 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

Hello,

Can anyone help me on this ? I think members of this list are the best people
around who can help me or at least redirect me to another ressource

Help really appeciated

Regards

Angelo

– Message original –
Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 12:54:36 +0100
From: xxxxx@bluewin.ch
Subject: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>
>
>
>Hello,
>
>I’ve question about windows boot and drivers loading during that phase.

>
>Here is my case, I’ve moved a disk to a new system that has diff?rent hardware,
>but that should support the physical drive moved. Then during the boot phase
>I got a blue screen which strangely lasts only a fraction of a second…
>I’m not able to look a the error codes…
>
>I wanted to understand what could cause this issue and try to grasp the
way
>Windows uses the Plug and Play technology to recognize the hardware present(connected
>to the motherboard) and the way it accomodates thoses changes…
>
>In order to attempt a repair, I changed, based on several articles found
>on the internet, a couple of keys in the registry using a tool called “ERD
>Commander”. Those keys are related to PNP.
>
>The first one, is under CriticalDataBase (which should in my understanding
>match a VendoIR-ProductID to service and a driver component on disk). The
>second one was under services in order add the relation with the PNP device
>and to change the startup value to zero…Blue screen always here
>
>
>Can anyone tell me how the PNP works on windows ? How the device is related
>to the driver or drivers components (.sys,.dll) on the system ? Is the ENUM
>key only generated at setup time and should also be modified to accomodate
>the change ? How can I troubleshoot those things ?
>
>Thanks in advance
>
>Angelo
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

—
You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument: ‘’
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5

How can I find information that decribes the internal working of boot drivers(mass
storage,…) and the way windows load and initialize them(after BIOS is loaded
and executed) ? I’d like also to understand the Pnp stuff at this level.

Could anyone give me a reference at Microsoft or so that could help me grasp
this stuff ? I’ve already read a couple of books related to drivers and so
but even if these are excellent books they dont have the information I’m
looking for.

Regards

– Message original –
Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2006 19:40:37 -0800
From: “Satya Das”
>To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>
>
>It seems the move was not something that the OS likes and you should not
>be surprised.
>
>I don’t know what kind of BSOD you are getting and what you did in ERD commander
>(not familiar with that software). But I would guess you are seeing a STOP
>0x0000007B INACCESSIBLE_BOOT_DEVICE.
>
>If you are then, I have personally never been able to get around it and
have
>always had to install afresh. Some folks on the net seem to have found some
>solutions to their problems by following certain steps, but I would recommend
>caution before trusting these and of course backup everything so if you
maim
>the install, you can say you tried.
>
>Satya
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com]
>On Behalf Of xxxxx@bluewin.ch
>Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2006 8:14 AM
>To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
>Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
>
>
>Hello,
>
>Can anyone help me on this ? I think members of this list are the best people
>around who can help me or at least redirect me to another ressource
>
>Help really appeciated
>
>Regards
>
>Angelo
>
>>– Message original –
>>Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 12:54:36 +0100
>>From: xxxxx@bluewin.ch
>>Subject: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
>>To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>>
>>
>>
>>Hello,
>>
>>I’ve question about windows boot and drivers loading during that phase.
>
>>
>>Here is my case, I’ve moved a disk to a new system that has diff?rent hardware,
>>but that should support the physical drive moved. Then during the boot
phase
>>I got a blue screen which strangely lasts only a fraction of a second…
>>I’m not able to look a the error codes…
>>
>>I wanted to understand what could cause this issue and try to grasp the
>way
>>Windows uses the Plug and Play technology to recognize the hardware present(connected
>>to the motherboard) and the way it accomodates thoses changes…
>>
>>In order to attempt a repair, I changed, based on several articles found
>>on the internet, a couple of keys in the registry using a tool called “ERD
>>Commander”. Those keys are related to PNP.
>>
>>The first one, is under CriticalDataBase (which should in my understanding
>>match a VendoIR-ProductID to service and a driver component on disk). The
>>second one was under services in order add the relation with the PNP device
>>and to change the startup value to zero…Blue screen always here
>>
>>
>>Can anyone tell me how the PNP works on windows ? How the device is related
>>to the driver or drivers components (.sys,.dll) on the system ? Is the
ENUM
>>key only generated at setup time and should also be modified to accomodate
>>the change ? How can I troubleshoot those things ?
>>
>>Thanks in advance
>>
>>Angelo
>>
>>
>>
>>—
>>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>>‘’
>>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

6

“Inside Windows 2000”, Solomon and Russinovich.

Gary G. Little

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of
xxxxx@bluewin.ch
Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2006 4:31 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

How can I find information that decribes the internal working of boot
drivers(mass
storage,…) and the way windows load and initialize them(after BIOS is
loaded
and executed) ? I’d like also to understand the Pnp stuff at this level.

Could anyone give me a reference at Microsoft or so that could help me
grasp
this stuff ? I’ve already read a couple of books related to drivers and so
but even if these are excellent books they dont have the information I’m
looking for.

Regards

– Message original –
Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2006 19:40:37 -0800
From: “Satya Das”
>To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>
>
>It seems the move was not something that the OS likes and you should not
>be surprised.
>
>I don’t know what kind of BSOD you are getting and what you did in ERD
commander
>(not familiar with that software). But I would guess you are seeing a
STOP
>0x0000007B INACCESSIBLE_BOOT_DEVICE.
>
>If you are then, I have personally never been able to get around it and
have
>always had to install afresh. Some folks on the net seem to have found
some
>solutions to their problems by following certain steps, but I would
recommend
>caution before trusting these and of course backup everything so if you
maim
>the install, you can say you tried.
>
>Satya
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com]
>On Behalf Of xxxxx@bluewin.ch
>Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2006 8:14 AM
>To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
>Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
>
>
>Hello,
>
>Can anyone help me on this ? I think members of this list are the best
people
>around who can help me or at least redirect me to another ressource
>
>Help really appeciated
>
>Regards
>
>Angelo
>
>>– Message original –
>>Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 12:54:36 +0100
>>From: xxxxx@bluewin.ch
>>Subject: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)
>>To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>>Reply-To: “Kernel Debugging Interest List”
>>
>>
>>
>>Hello,
>>
>>I’ve question about windows boot and drivers loading during that phase.
>
>>
>>Here is my case, I’ve moved a disk to a new system that has diff?rent
hardware,
>>but that should support the physical drive moved. Then during the boot
phase
>>I got a blue screen which strangely lasts only a fraction of a second…
>>I’m not able to look a the error codes…
>>
>>I wanted to understand what could cause this issue and try to grasp the
>way
>>Windows uses the Plug and Play technology to recognize the hardware
present(connected
>>to the motherboard) and the way it accomodates thoses changes…
>>
>>In order to attempt a repair, I changed, based on several articles found
>>on the internet, a couple of keys in the registry using a tool called
“ERD
>>Commander”. Those keys are related to PNP.
>>
>>The first one, is under CriticalDataBase (which should in my
understanding
>>match a VendoIR-ProductID to service and a driver component on disk).
The
>>second one was under services in order add the relation with the PNP
device
>>and to change the startup value to zero…Blue screen always here
>>
>>
>>Can anyone tell me how the PNP works on windows ? How the device is
related
>>to the driver or drivers components (.sys,.dll) on the system ? Is the
ENUM
>>key only generated at setup time and should also be modified to
accomodate
>>the change ? How can I troubleshoot those things ?
>>
>>Thanks in advance
>>
>>Angelo
>>
>>
>>
>>—
>>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>>‘’
>>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com
>
>
>
>—
>You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
>‘’
>To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

—
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7

Gary G. Little wrote:

Was this the boot disc you moved to become the boot disc for “different
hardware”? If not then possibly the BIOS is not seeing the disc and during
boot it is needed, or the BIOS thinks the moved disc is the boot disc.

If it is the boot disc then the operative words there are “new system that
has different hardware”. That MIGHT work if you go from a Latitude D610 to
another Latitude D610 built in the same year and lot number. The problem is
the “different hardware”, which the OS you moved knows nothing about, and
consequently tries to load wrong drivers. You are lucky you even got a BSOD.

Well, that’s a bit of an exaggeration. As long as the main disk
controller is the same technology (ATA, SCSI, SATA), and neither system
requires an exotic HAL, this will work most of the time. The majority
of today’s computers are more alike than they are different. If you can
get the kernel in memory and executing, plug-and-play will sort out the
hardware differences.

You can image an existing HDD, replace it with a new HDD and then image the
new disc with the image you saved from the older disc, but moving an
existing OS disc to the boot disc of a new CPU is not likely to work.

Yes. In fact, my most successful recipe for brain transplants like this
is to install a new copy of the OS on the new disk into a directory with
an odd name, then robocopy everything from the original disk, change
boot.ini to point to the original install, reboot, and erase the new OS
directory.

–
Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

8

Thanks, Tim, that’s a trick I had not tried yet.

Gary G. Little

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@probo.com
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 11:39 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: Re: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

Gary G. Little wrote:

Was this the boot disc you moved to become the boot disc for “different
hardware”? If not then possibly the BIOS is not seeing the disc and
during
boot it is needed, or the BIOS thinks the moved disc is the boot disc.

If it is the boot disc then the operative words there are “new system
that
has different hardware”. That MIGHT work if you go from a Latitude D610
to
another Latitude D610 built in the same year and lot number. The problem
is
the “different hardware”, which the OS you moved knows nothing about, and
consequently tries to load wrong drivers. You are lucky you even got a
BSOD.

Well, that’s a bit of an exaggeration. As long as the main disk
controller is the same technology (ATA, SCSI, SATA), and neither system
requires an exotic HAL, this will work most of the time. The majority
of today’s computers are more alike than they are different. If you can
get the kernel in memory and executing, plug-and-play will sort out the
hardware differences.

You can image an existing HDD, replace it with a new HDD and then image
the
new disc with the image you saved from the older disc, but moving an
existing OS disc to the boot disc of a new CPU is not likely to work.

Yes. In fact, my most successful recipe for brain transplants like this
is to install a new copy of the OS on the new disk into a directory with
an odd name, then robocopy everything from the original disk, change
boot.ini to point to the original install, reboot, and erase the new OS
directory.

–
Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

You are currently subscribed to windbg as: xxxxx@seagate.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

9

>Well, that’s a bit of an exaggeration. As long as the main disk

controller is the same technology (ATA, SCSI, SATA), and neither system
requires an exotic HAL, this will work most of the time.

FWIW, I used to think that. But I have had issues switching ATA disk
from one desktop to another (both were on acpi)

10

For what it is worth, you don’t have to do a full blown install. Put
the HD in the new machine, run setup from a CD and do an in place
upgrade using the same directory. After txt mode setup if finished, you
have a bootable image again. While in txt mode setup, you can also
choose repair and then from the cmd prompt, there is a boot disk repair
utility somewhere under the covers.

d

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Satya Das
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 10:38 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

Well, that’s a bit of an exaggeration. As long as the main disk
controller is the same technology (ATA, SCSI, SATA), and neither system
requires an exotic HAL, this will work most of the time.

FWIW, I used to think that. But I have had issues switching ATA disk
from one desktop to another (both were on acpi)

You are currently subscribed to windbg as: unknown lmsubst tag argument:
‘’
To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com

11

Satya Das wrote:

FWIW, I used to think that. But I have had issues switching ATA disk
from one desktop to another (both were on acpi)

In my experience, the only problem I’ve had comes from BIOS differences,
where they implement the large disk extensions in different ways. Also,
that was motherboards from several years ago; I think that more modern
systems actually are more alike (with >160G BIOS addressing).

Cheers,

/ h+

12

Peter/Tony,

I dunno if this has anything to do with the changes you just made to the
list but this, and a couple other posts, are those dreaded “re-runs”.

Gary G. Little

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of
xxxxx@mindcontrol.org
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 9:59 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: Re: [windbg] Blue screen after move of physical drive (scsi)

Satya Das wrote:

FWIW, I used to think that. But I have had issues switching ATA disk
from one desktop to another (both were on acpi)

In my experience, the only problem I’ve had comes from BIOS differences,
where they implement the large disk extensions in different ways. Also,
that was motherboards from several years ago; I think that more modern
systems actually are more alike (with >160G BIOS addressing).

Cheers,

/ h+

You are currently subscribed to windbg as: xxxxx@seagate.com
To unsubscribe send a blank email to xxxxx@lists.osr.com