RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

“Device Manager. Look under “IEEE 1394 Bus host controllers”. If the
category isn’t present, then you don’t have one already.”
No, I do not see it in Device Manager". So, where do I get one? Or it comes with a card?
Do I need 1394 controller on host and target or target only?

Paul mentioned “Help file” : You need to read the Help file.
Which one? Windbg?

Yes, the windbg help file.

I think Don may have already mentioned this, but you might try reading the
‘kernel_debugging_tutorial.doc’ file that can be found in the root of your
windbg installation. It details how to setup a 1394 kd session.

You need to read this and reference the windbg docs when you are lost.

Good luck,

mm
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 7:31 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

“Device Manager. Look under “IEEE 1394 Bus host controllers”. If the
category isn’t present, then you don’t have one already.”
No, I do not see it in Device Manager". So, where do I get one? Or it comes
with a card?
Do I need 1394 controller on host and target or target only?

Paul mentioned “Help file” : You need to read the Help file.
Which one? Windbg?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

xxxxx@aol.com wrote:

“Device Manager. Look under “IEEE 1394 Bus host controllers”. If the
category isn’t present, then you don’t have one already.”
No, I do not see it in Device Manager". So, where do I get one? Or it comes with a card?
Do I need 1394 controller on host and target or target only?

1394 (also called Firewire) is a bus, rather similar to USB. It should
be clear that, for two computers to talk over a 1394 bus, you will need
a 1394 bus controller in each computer.

What are you hoping to debug? I’m wondering if you’re really prepared
for what you’re getting into.


Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?

I think I got it now!
Gentlemen, thank you all for your time and input!
Your help is really appreciated!

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger. Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER. If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394 controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits. Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

One last thing.

Make sure you actually shutdown your machines before you open them up and plug in the cards.

You will also need a 1394 cable with which you plug the 2 cards together. Some of the Rosewill cards come with a cable.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Ballantyne
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 5:10 PM
To: ‘Kernel Debugging Interest List’
Subject: RE: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger. Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER. If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394 controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits. Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

Dear Joe!
This is increadible! You actually took time to walk me step be step!
Thank you so much!
And thanks again everybody, who participated and helped!
With greatest respect, David.

Just a follow up.
Bought two Rosewill Firewire/1394a Low-Profile PCI Cards. One regular and one Express.
Will try them as soon as they arrive.
Still need some clarification:
Joe writes:
“DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER. If
either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the picture of
the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394 controller,
just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows device manager.”

“Controller” in this case means “chipset”, right?
“Chipset” comes with a card.
So if it is already inside of the machine, it means that this machine has built-in, on-board “card” (chipset (or “controller”) and physical connector), correct?
In my case, since I do not have it preinstalled by computer manufacturer, I purchase a “card”, which means “chipset”(controller) + physical connector?
Please help me to clarify this, I am a bit fuzzy on this terminology.

>Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM

given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound >register that LSI
hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

Learn something new every day…When you say, “not ideal”, is there a
noticeable difference when working with a card that supports this versus one
that doesn’t? Obviously it’s going to depend greatly on the memory ranges
that you’re looking at, but just curious.

Thanks!

-scott


Scott Noone
Consulting Associate and Chief System Problem Analyst
OSR Open Systems Resources, Inc.
http://www.osronline.com

“Joe Ballantyne” wrote in message news:xxxxx@windbg…

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given
the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from
www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger.
Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM
given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI
hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could
find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified
below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI
express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI
and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your
machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug
in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just
disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER.
If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the
picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394
controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows
device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from
the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the
box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits.
Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many
questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two
available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

I’m curious on the statement about the statement “should work just fine as
long as you use the latest debugger”, does this mean they don’t work with
the older debuggers? I ask this since I use a variety of versions of Windbg
because:

  1. Each version of Windbg has its own peculiar bugs, sometimes these bugs
    can really get in the way of the work and moving to a slightly older
    debugger eliminates the problem.

  2. If you write a debugger extension, you should test it on all the
    versions of Windbg that are likely to use it. This means more than one
    version of the debugger!

So do the cards work with older versions of Windbg?

Don Burn (MVP, Windows DKD)
Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Website: http://www.windrvr.com
Blog: http://msmvps.com/blogs/WinDrvr

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Joe Ballantyne
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 8:10 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given
the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from
www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger.
Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM
given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI
hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could
find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified
below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI
express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI
and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your
machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug
in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just
disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER.
If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the
picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394
controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows
device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from
the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the
box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits.
Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many
questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two
available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

Yes, there is.

As I recall, without PhysicalUpperBound support, the debugger is unable to DMA memory above 4GB from the target to the host. This forces the debugger back to the same (slower) mechanism that the other debugger transports have to use for memory reads from the host which means that operations such as writing a dump out from the 1394 link will go much slower than they would on a machine with PhysicalUpperBound (or physical addresses <4GB).

  • S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Scott Noone
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 5:40 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: Re:[windbg] remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of
RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound >register
that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

Learn something new every day…When you say, “not ideal”, is there a noticeable difference when working with a card that supports this versus one that doesn’t? Obviously it’s going to depend greatly on the memory ranges that you’re looking at, but just curious.

Thanks!

-scott


Scott Noone
Consulting Associate and Chief System Problem Analyst OSR Open Systems Resources, Inc.
http://www.osronline.com

“Joe Ballantyne” wrote in message news:xxxxx@windbg…

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger.
Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER.
If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394 controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits.
Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many
questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two
available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

That’s pretty funny, so your debug connection could go from blazing fast
1394 DMA madness to poky and you’d basically be left scratching your head.
Definitely a good thing to keep in mind.

Thanks!

-scott


Scott Noone
Consulting Associate and Chief System Problem Analyst
OSR Open Systems Resources, Inc.
http://www.osronline.com

“Skywing” wrote in message news:xxxxx@windbg…

Yes, there is.

As I recall, without PhysicalUpperBound support, the debugger is unable to
DMA memory above 4GB from the target to the host. This forces the debugger
back to the same (slower) mechanism that the other debugger transports have
to use for memory reads from the host which means that operations such as
writing a dump out from the 1394 link will go much slower than they would on
a machine with PhysicalUpperBound (or physical addresses <4GB).

  • S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Scott Noone
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 5:40 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: Re:[windbg] remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of
RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound >register
that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

Learn something new every day…When you say, “not ideal”, is there a
noticeable difference when working with a card that supports this versus one
that doesn’t? Obviously it’s going to depend greatly on the memory ranges
that you’re looking at, but just curious.

Thanks!

-scott


Scott Noone
Consulting Associate and Chief System Problem Analyst OSR Open Systems
Resources, Inc.
http://www.osronline.com

“Joe Ballantyne” wrote in message news:xxxxx@windbg…

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given
the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from
www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger.
Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM
given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI
hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could
find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified
below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI
express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI
and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your
machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug
in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just
disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER.
If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the
picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394
controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows
device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from
the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the
box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits.
Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many
questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two
available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

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I believe we do have a warning if we detect that this will happen when one tries to issue a .dump, FWIW.

  • S (Msft)

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Scott Noone
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 9:10 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: Re:[windbg] remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

That’s pretty funny, so your debug connection could go from blazing fast
1394 DMA madness to poky and you’d basically be left scratching your head.
Definitely a good thing to keep in mind.

Thanks!

-scott


Scott Noone
Consulting Associate and Chief System Problem Analyst OSR Open Systems Resources, Inc.
http://www.osronline.com

“Skywing” wrote in message news:xxxxx@windbg…

Yes, there is.

As I recall, without PhysicalUpperBound support, the debugger is unable to DMA memory above 4GB from the target to the host. This forces the debugger back to the same (slower) mechanism that the other debugger transports have to use for memory reads from the host which means that operations such as writing a dump out from the 1394 link will go much slower than they would on a machine with PhysicalUpperBound (or physical addresses <4GB).

  • S

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Scott Noone
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 5:40 AM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: Re:[windbg] remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of
RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound >register
that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

Learn something new every day…When you say, “not ideal”, is there a noticeable difference when working with a card that supports this versus one that doesn’t? Obviously it’s going to depend greatly on the memory ranges that you’re looking at, but just curious.

Thanks!

-scott


Scott Noone
Consulting Associate and Chief System Problem Analyst OSR Open Systems Resources, Inc.
http://www.osronline.com

“Joe Ballantyne” wrote in message news:xxxxx@windbg…

You don’t have to buy OSR’s TI cards. You can, and probably should given the amount of support you are getting from the site, but ~$10 cards from www.newegg.com should work just fine as long as you use the latest debugger.
Furthermore TI cards are not ideal for x64 machines with 4GB or more of RAM given that they do not support the PhysicalUpperBound register that LSI hardware (523 chips and later) supports.

If I were you I would just get the cheapest Rosewill 1394a cards I could find on Newegg. As long as you use the latest debugger release (specified below), it should work with any OHCI 1394 card in the target machine.

If you don’t have any PCI slots in the newer of your machines, only PCI express, and the machine doesn’t already have 1394, then you will need 1 PCI and 1 PCI express card. The PCI express cards cost more $, but if your machine only has PCI express slots available, then you have no choice.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1394a

Make SURE that neither of you computers has a plug that looks like the plug in the picture of the addin card.

If either do, then you actually already have a 1394 controller, it is just disabled in the BIOS, and you need to go into the BIOS and enable it.

(F2, or Del usually get you into the BIOS configuration.)

DO NOT PUT A 1394 CARD IN YOUR MACHINE, IF IT ALREADY HAS A 1394 CONTROLLER.
If either of your machines has a plug anywhere on it that matches the picture of the plug of the addin 1394 card on Wikipedia, then it HAS a 1394 controller, just figure out how to enable it so it shows up in Windows device manager.

Make sure your debugger is at least 6.12.2.633. If not, then go get it from the Microsoft website.

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinDbg

The link to the Microsoft website to get the debugger is on the RHS in the box.

In windbg, click on the help menu, then click on search.

Type 1394 in the search box and press enter. You should get lots of hits.
Read them.
Bcdedit also gives lots of hits;

Read them.

To enable 1394 debugging on a vista target machine:

Run an elevated (admin privileges) command prompt then type

Bcdedit -dbgsettings 1394 channel:1
Bcdedit -debug on

Then in the host machine open an elevated command prompt, and run

Windbg -k 1394:channel=1

Press ctrl-alt-k twice. (should say will breakin at first symbol load)

Then reboot the target machine.

(shutdown -r -t 0 in the command prompt)

You should connect at boot and the debugger will breakin.

Press g to let the machine boot.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
[mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 4:46 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home
premium?

Setting up a session after I have all hardware in place is not a problem.
But so far I used only null-modem cable that is why I am asking so many
questions.
To summarize:
I need two 1394 PCI cards (one regular, one express), a cable, and two
available PCI slots.
Anything else?
KD and WinDbg will be able to use the cards.
That’s should be all, correct?


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

xxxxx@aol.com wrote:

Just a follow up.
Bought two Rosewill Firewire/1394a Low-Profile PCI Cards. One regular and one Express.
Will try them as soon as they arrive.
Still need some clarification:

“Controller” in this case means “chipset”, right?
“Chipset” comes with a card.
So if it is already inside of the machine, it means that this machine has built-in, on-board “card” (chipset (or “controller”) and physical connector), correct?
In my case, since I do not have it preinstalled by computer manufacturer, I purchase a “card”, which means “chipset”(controller) + physical connector?
Please help me to clarify this, I am a bit fuzzy on this terminology.

Does any of this really matter? Either you have a 1394 bus provider, or
you don’t. If you don’t, you need to add one. The form in which the
service is provided is really irrelevant.


Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

Greetings, Gentlemen!
I am still having problems. Here is the most recent update.
Purchased and installed two Rosewill PCI FireWire 1394a cards, as Joe suggested.
Both working properly, confirmed in Device manage.
When I start windbg, it is trying to locate 1394kdbg.sys driver. After not finding it is trying to install it.
But it fails: FAILED TO ADD 1394 DEBUG DEVICE TO 1394 BUS. ERROR 0X80070032.
WinDbg version is 6.12.0002.633 x86.
1394 host controller is grabbed for debugging on the targer (Vista). I tried to disable it but it did not seem to matter.
My host operating system is WINDOWS 2000 SP4. I’ve done some research of this problem (including on OSR forums) and it is said somewhere that this OS on the host does not support remote debugging. If that’s the case, then I have no choise but give up.

W2k is pretty long in the tooth. (and I’m being kind…)

I don’t think anyone else has tried to use it as host machine kernel debugging platform for a long time.

You could try to get the .inf in the debugger 1394 directory to install manually, but I don’t know that that will succeed where the automatic installation failed.

The 1394 controller in the host should be banged out code 31 if debugging has been properly enabled. If you see code 31 in the target, then kd1394.dll has found and configured the 1394 controller on the target machine successfully.

My advice to you would be to clean install XPSP3 on your host, then install all the WU patches, and then install the debugger and my guess is that it will work fine.

How much RAM does that W2k host machine have?

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:08 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Greetings, Gentlemen!
I am still having problems. Here is the most recent update.
Purchased and installed two Rosewill PCI FireWire 1394a cards, as Joe suggested.
Both working properly, confirmed in Device manage.
When I start windbg, it is trying to locate 1394kdbg.sys driver. After not finding it is trying to install it.
But it fails: FAILED TO ADD 1394 DEBUG DEVICE TO 1394 BUS. ERROR 0X80070032.
WinDbg version is 6.12.0002.633 x86.
1394 host controller is grabbed for debugging on the targer (Vista). I tried to disable it but it did not seem to matter.
My host operating system is WINDOWS 2000 SP4. I’ve done some research of this problem (including on OSR forums) and it is said somewhere that this OS on the host does not support remote debugging. If that’s the case, then I have no choise but give up.


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

This: The 1394 controller in the host should be banged out

Should read: The 1394 controller in the TARGET machine should be banged out

It is critical that the 1394 controller in the host machine NOT be banged out at all.

Sorry about that.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Ballantyne
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:20 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

W2k is pretty long in the tooth. (and I’m being kind…)

I don’t think anyone else has tried to use it as host machine kernel debugging platform for a long time.

You could try to get the .inf in the debugger 1394 directory to install manually, but I don’t know that that will succeed where the automatic installation failed.

The 1394 controller in the host should be banged out code 31 if debugging has been properly enabled. If you see code 31 in the target, then kd1394.dll has found and configured the 1394 controller on the target machine successfully.

My advice to you would be to clean install XPSP3 on your host, then install all the WU patches, and then install the debugger and my guess is that it will work fine.

How much RAM does that W2k host machine have?

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:08 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Greetings, Gentlemen!
I am still having problems. Here is the most recent update.
Purchased and installed two Rosewill PCI FireWire 1394a cards, as Joe suggested.
Both working properly, confirmed in Device manage.
When I start windbg, it is trying to locate 1394kdbg.sys driver. After not finding it is trying to install it.
But it fails: FAILED TO ADD 1394 DEBUG DEVICE TO 1394 BUS. ERROR 0X80070032.
WinDbg version is 6.12.0002.633 x86.
1394 host controller is grabbed for debugging on the targer (Vista). I tried to disable it but it did not seem to matter.
My host operating system is WINDOWS 2000 SP4. I’ve done some research of this problem (including on OSR forums) and it is said somewhere that this OS on the host does not support remote debugging. If that’s the case, then I have no choise but give up.


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

I suspect that the 1394kdbg.sys driver may very well have imports that can’t be satisfied by the NT4 kernel. I think it may be XP and up only.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Joe Ballantyne
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:22 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

This: The 1394 controller in the host should be banged out

Should read: The 1394 controller in the TARGET machine should be banged out

It is critical that the 1394 controller in the host machine NOT be banged out at all.

Sorry about that.

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Ballantyne
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:20 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

W2k is pretty long in the tooth. (and I’m being kind…)

I don’t think anyone else has tried to use it as host machine kernel debugging platform for a long time.

You could try to get the .inf in the debugger 1394 directory to install manually, but I don’t know that that will succeed where the automatic installation failed.

The 1394 controller in the host should be banged out code 31 if debugging has been properly enabled. If you see code 31 in the target, then kd1394.dll has found and configured the 1394 controller on the target machine successfully.

My advice to you would be to clean install XPSP3 on your host, then install all the WU patches, and then install the debugger and my guess is that it will work fine.

How much RAM does that W2k host machine have?

Joe.

-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of xxxxx@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:08 PM
To: Kernel Debugging Interest List
Subject: RE:[windbg] RE: remote kernel debugging on windows vista home premium?

Greetings, Gentlemen!
I am still having problems. Here is the most recent update.
Purchased and installed two Rosewill PCI FireWire 1394a cards, as Joe suggested.
Both working properly, confirmed in Device manage.
When I start windbg, it is trying to locate 1394kdbg.sys driver. After not finding it is trying to install it.
But it fails: FAILED TO ADD 1394 DEBUG DEVICE TO 1394 BUS. ERROR 0X80070032.
WinDbg version is 6.12.0002.633 x86.
1394 host controller is grabbed for debugging on the targer (Vista). I tried to disable it but it did not seem to matter.
My host operating system is WINDOWS 2000 SP4. I’ve done some research of this problem (including on OSR forums) and it is said somewhere that this OS on the host does not support remote debugging. If that’s the case, then I have no choise but give up.


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer


WINDBG is sponsored by OSR

For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars

To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer

I suspect that the 1394kdbg.sys driver may very well have imports that can’t be
satisfied by the NT4 kernel. I think it may be XP and up only.

That’s what I thought too, unfortunately…
So, in other words, we are done here…