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Question regarding Deprecation of Software Publisher Certificates?

2»

Comments

  • Dejan_MaksimovicDejan_Maksimovic Member - All Emails Posts: 430
    via Email
    You cannot cross sign a driver with an OV certificate and have it load on
    Win10.
    At least it never worked for me, unless the driver was signed before ~June
    2015.
  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @Dejan_Maksimovic said:
    You cannot cross sign a driver with an OV certificate and have it load on Win10.
    At least it never worked for me, unless the driver was signed before ~June 2015.

    Same with EV. They have no difference in this respect.

  • Peter_Viscarola_(OSR)Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) Administrator Posts: 8,399
    edited March 2

    OK... I've moved my post to a new thread so it'll be more visible to those who haven't been following this topic:

    New thread here.

    Peter

    Peter Viscarola
    OSR
    @OSRDrivers

  • Peter_Viscarola_(OSR)Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) Administrator Posts: 8,399

    @john_smith1978

    Since mid-2015 all SHA-2 code signing certificates are issued from our OVCS or EVCS issuing CAs. These issuing CAs are subordinate to Our G2 CA cert. G2 was also cross-certified by Microsoft...

    If "subordinary to" technically means "chain-up to" (which would be reasonable) then such a cert **should **be usable with the G2 cross-cert to cross-sign drivers, and let them load on down-level versions of Windows. The only catch is if MSFT decides to revoke the root cert to which the cross-cert chains up. That doesn't seem realistic, though. Everything that chains-up to that cert would be invalidated.

    I wish Entrust would make it easier to buy a Code Signing Cert from them... OV would be sufficient for this purpose.

    I hope somebody gets one of these, cross-signed, and posts the cert chain so we'll all know for sure.

    Peter

    Peter Viscarola
    OSR
    @OSRDrivers

  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) said:
    I wish Entrust would make it easier to buy a Code Signing Cert from them... OV would be sufficient for this purpose.
    I hope somebody gets one of these, cross-signed, and posts the cert chain so we'll all know for sure.

    We are working on getting the Entrust EV. It will take a while, but as soon as I lay my hands on it, I'm going to check the chain (unless someone else manages to get it sooner).

  • Peter_Viscarola_(OSR)Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) Administrator Posts: 8,399

    @CaptainFlint

    Thanks, Captain. We'll be grateful for whatever info you can provide.

    Peter

    Peter Viscarola
    OSR
    @OSRDrivers

  • henrik_meidahenrik_meida Member Posts: 40

    @CaptainFlint said:

    @Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) said:
    I wish Entrust would make it easier to buy a Code Signing Cert from them... OV would be sufficient for this purpose.
    I hope somebody gets one of these, cross-signed, and posts the cert chain so we'll all know for sure.

    We are working on getting the Entrust EV. It will take a while, but as soon as I lay my hands on it, I'm going to check the chain (unless someone else manages to get it sooner).

    Hi Flint,

    Any update on that Entrust cert? did you get it? If so, can you please post the cert chain for us, so we can see if it in fact chains up to G2 CA?

  • Peter_Viscarola_(OSR)Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) Administrator Posts: 8,399

    You did see that MSFT said they would revoke the cert for anyone who used it after 1 July 2020 for cross-signing drivers for down level OS versions, right?

    Not sayin’ this makes your question invalid... just wanted to be sure you saw MSFT’s most recent position on this.

    Peter

    Peter Viscarola
    OSR
    @OSRDrivers

  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @henrik_meida said:
    Any update on that Entrust cert? did you get it? If so, can you please post the cert chain for us, so we can see if it in fact chains up to G2 CA?

    Unfortunately we met with some difficulties during the company verification stage, which have never occurred before. My colleagues are still fighting it... :(

  • henrik_meidahenrik_meida Member Posts: 40
    edited April 5

    @Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) said:
    You did see that MSFT said they would revoke the cert for anyone who used it after 1 July 2020 for cross-signing drivers for down level OS versions, right?

    Not sayin’ this makes your question invalid... just wanted to be sure you saw MSFT’s most recent position on this.

    Peter

    Yes i saw that, but we might have a shot at asking Microsoft for permission of cross signing with that cert only for supporting older operating systems like 7, i know its unlikely for them to accept but worth the shot. and we would obviously tell them why we can't pass the WHQL test for some of our drivers.

  • henrik_meidahenrik_meida Member Posts: 40

    @CaptainFlint said:

    @henrik_meida said:
    Any update on that Entrust cert? did you get it? If so, can you please post the cert chain for us, so we can see if it in fact chains up to G2 CA?

    Unfortunately we met with some difficulties during the company verification stage, which have never occurred before. My colleagues are still fighting it... :(

    Would you mind telling us what exactly they did for verification? and what were these difficulties? I thought the EV verification process is pretty straight forward?!

  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @henrik_meida said:
    Would you mind telling us what exactly they did for verification? and what were these difficulties? I thought the EV verification process is pretty straight forward?!

    I'm not sure how much I'm allowed to disclose, it may be considered sensitive information. But basically, it now requires some third-party independent sources to confirm the information we provide. And some of the required data were not available via any of the sources, which the verification service considered trusted. So we are arranging legal confirmations that would satisfy Entrust, but it takes time.

  • henrik_meidahenrik_meida Member Posts: 40
    edited April 6

    @CaptainFlint said:

    @henrik_meida said:
    Would you mind telling us what exactly they did for verification? and what were these difficulties? I thought the EV verification process is pretty straight forward?!

    I'm not sure how much I'm allowed to disclose, it may be considered sensitive information. But basically, it now requires some third-party independent sources to confirm the information we provide. And some of the required data were not available via any of the sources, which the verification service considered trusted. So we are arranging legal confirmations that would satisfy Entrust, but it takes time.

    So I'm assuming you didn't have a DUNS number, correct? because based on what i heard, having one will conclude the verification process.

    We are in the process of getting one, and after that we'll try Entrust. But please do update us when you finally got your certificate.

  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @henrik_meida said:
    So I'm assuming you didn't have a DUNS number, correct? because based on what i heard, having one will conclude the verification process.

    No, it's not the DUNS that caused problems. As I said, we have already been buying EV certificates before, and never had any issues.

    But please do update us when you finally got your certificate.

    I certainly will. :+1:

  • Peter_Viscarola_(OSR)Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) Administrator Posts: 8,399

    we might have a shot at asking Microsoft for permission of cross signing with that cert only for supporting older operating systems like 7

    You might note that this is precisely the circumstance for which they are threatening to revoke your cert. not any other situation. I’ve personally advocated, asked, pleased, and explained. And the last reply I got was “see this new section of this document”... which was the threat to revoke the cert.

    They’re not going to help us. Period. Full stop.

    Peter

    Peter Viscarola
    OSR
    @OSRDrivers

  • henrik_meidahenrik_meida Member Posts: 40

    @Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) said:

    we might have a shot at asking Microsoft for permission of cross signing with that cert only for supporting older operating systems like 7

    You might note that this is precisely the circumstance for which they are threatening to revoke your cert. not any other situation. I’ve personally advocated, asked, pleased, and explained. And the last reply I got was “see this new section of this document”... which was the threat to revoke the cert.

    They’re not going to help us. Period. Full stop.

    Peter

    Well we know that it will likely not work, but still worth the shot.

    @CaptainFlint said:

    @henrik_meida said:
    So I'm assuming you didn't have a DUNS number, correct? because based on what i heard, having one will conclude the verification process.

    No, it's not the DUNS that caused problems. As I said, we have already been buying EV certificates before, and never had any issues.

    But please do update us when you finally got your certificate.

    I certainly will. :+1:

    One thing i forgot to ask, do you think that if we get a DUNs number that will count as our verification, and basically complete the whole verification process with Entrust? because currently we are in the process of getting one, and we are not sure if we should wait until we get it, then proceed with the purchase or not, any thoughts ?

  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @henrik_meida said:
    One thing i forgot to ask, do you think that if we get a DUNs number that will count as our verification, and basically complete the whole verification process with Entrust? because currently we are in the process of getting one, and we are not sure if we should wait until we get it, then proceed with the purchase or not, any thoughts ?

    Unfortunately, I don't know all the details, I've caught just a few glimpses. I'm not been involved in the process of either buying the certificate, or verifying the company. My taks is a purely technical one, to make certain our tools work with the certificate when we finally get it.

    I recommend you contact Entrust and check with them. From what I've seen in our internal emails, they are quite helpful.

  • Mark_RoddyMark_Roddy Member - All Emails Posts: 4,426
    via Email
    Having just gone through this with entrust, all I needed was 1) a
    registered corporation of any sort (e.g. a LLC) 2) a registered domain that
    could be verified as owned by said LLC.

    Mark Roddy
  • RourkeRourke Member Posts: 61

    @Tim_Roberts said:
    EV is only a requirement for creating a Hardware Dashboard account.

    Are you saying if one has a dashboard account there is no need to buy EV certs anymore because one can submit drivers for attestation using just a cheap, easy to get code signing certificate from then on? Are you absolutely certain of this?

  • CaptainFlintCaptainFlint Member Posts: 44

    @Rourke said:
    Are you saying if one has a dashboard account there is no need to buy EV certs anymore because one can submit drivers for attestation using just a cheap, easy to get code signing certificate from then on? Are you absolutely certain of this?

    You need to have an active EV certificate to keep using the dashboard services. As soon as it expires, you are automatically blocked from sending any submissions, until you attach a new active EV certificate to your account.

    I'm not sure if you can use any other certificate for signing your submission packages (I know you can do it for drivers). But even if you can, it's just a question of convenience (hardware EV token versus PFX files). You cannot save money/effort on that.

  • Tim_RobertsTim_Roberts Member - All Emails Posts: 13,907

    Yes, you need a current EV cert to maintain the dashboard account, as CaptainFlint said. You can use ANY certificate to sign your submissions, as long as you have registered the certificate with the dashboard account.

    Tim Roberts, [email protected]
    Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.

  • henrik_meidahenrik_meida Member Posts: 40

    @Mark_Roddy said:
    Having just gone through this with entrust, all I needed was 1) a
    registered corporation of any sort (e.g. a LLC) 2) a registered domain that
    could be verified as owned by said LLC.

    Mark Roddy

    Hi Mark, thank you for sharing,

    I have two questions and would be grateful if you can answer :

    1. Can you post the cert chain for us when you cross sign a driver with it, so we can see if it in fact chains up to G2 CA (that expires beyond 2022) ? or can you check it yourself and let us know ? (signtool verify /v /kp <mydriver.sys>)

    2. What documents with regards to our company/employees do we need to prepare to send Entrust? we first wanted to get a DUNs number before purchasing the EV but that is too complicated by its own so i think we might go for it before getting A DUNs. The problem is that our company doesn't have a Online present right now (No website or anything), do you think we need to prepare a website and a mail server using our own domain and send them the email with our own domain instead of using gmail for example?

  • Peter_Viscarola_(OSR)Peter_Viscarola_(OSR) Administrator Posts: 8,399

    @henrik_meida Haven’t we had this discussion before? Talk with the CA They are the only ones who can definitively tell you what they’ll accept.

    Peter

    Peter Viscarola
    OSR
    @OSRDrivers

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