I put this out on the Windbg list, but in hopes of a quicker response I am
posting here also:
I have a client setting up a debug environment, and am wondering what people
are using for 1394 PCIe cards. Especially could use advice with the OSR
Store being out of stock on the one they carry.
Don Burn
Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Website: http://www.windrvr.com
I gave up completely on 1394 debugging. As far as I am concerned if it
works it is luck and likely won’t work in the near future. I can’t handle
debug interfaces that are utterly fragile. I change set ups too much.
Mark Roddy
On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Don Burn wrote:
> I put this out on the Windbg list, but in hopes of a quicker response I am
> posting here also:
>
> I have a client setting up a debug environment, and am wondering what
> people
> are using for 1394 PCIe cards. Especially could use advice with the OSR
> Store being out of stock on the one they carry.
>
>
> Don Burn
> Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Website: http://www.windrvr.com
>
>
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev
>
> OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
Well except for serial (and finding systems with legacy serial ports is a challenge these days), I haven’t found anything more reliable. I and my clients have no interest in hypervisors, and multiple VM’s so the choices get limited quickly, especially when you need to support Win7 and onward.
Don Burn
Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Website: http://www.windrvr.com
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Mark Roddy
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2014 3:37 PM
To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
Subject: Re: [ntdev] Recomended PCIe 1394 cards for debugging
I gave up completely on 1394 debugging. As far as I am concerned if it works it is luck and likely won’t work in the near future. I can’t handle debug interfaces that are utterly fragile. I change set ups too much.
Mark Roddy
On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Don Burn wrote:
I put this out on the Windbg list, but in hopes of a quicker response I am
posting here also:
I have a client setting up a debug environment, and am wondering what people
are using for 1394 PCIe cards. Especially could use advice with the OSR
Store being out of stock on the one they carry.
Don Burn
Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Website: http://www.windrvr.com
—
NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev
OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers
For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
http://www.osr.com/seminars
To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
— NTDEV is sponsored by OSR Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit: http://www.osr.com/seminars To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
Don Burn wrote:
Well except for serial (and finding systems with legacy serial ports is a challenge these days), I haven’t found anything more reliable. I and my clients have no interest in hypervisors, and multiple VM’s so the choices get limited quickly, especially when you need to support Win7 and onward.
I’m doing more and more of my general debugging with Win 8 just because
I can use windbg over Ethernet. Every machine has an Ethernet port.
That is the least painful option yet invented.
However, I have never had a problem with windbg over 1394.
–
Tim Roberts, xxxxx@probo.com
Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc.
Hi Don,
I HIGHLY recommend 1394 debugging with LSI FW643 chipset based cards. A big factor is they support the optional high memory limit register, which allows hardware based RDMA read/write above the 4GB line. This means memory read performance is consistently fast on system with more than 4 GB of ram, They also support 800 Mbps firewire, and are a native PCie chip, not a PCI to PCIe bridge translation.
A year or two ago I talked about some specific card models over in the OSR windbg list. I also now have a Startech LSI chipset based 1394 that fits in a mini-pcie slot, which is useful on some systems. The Apple Thunderbolt to 1394 adapter (have not tried it as a target) also uses the LSI chipset, which I assume would work in any Thunderbolt port.
I believe this card http://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-Express-FireWire-Adapter-PEX1394B3/dp/B000WCT5HK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1412107902&sr=8-1&keywords=PEX1394B3 uses the LSI chipset and is available from Amazon or Staples. I have some LSI chipset based cards from Unibrain that work awesomely.
For 800 mbps firewire you do need to get the correct 800 mbps cables, which have a different connector.
Also note some cards are dual port, and you need to plug the cable into the correct connector or else use the busparms options to specify which 1394 device to use.
The LSI FW643 Unibrain cards were VERY stable and fast for kernel debugging. I used the Apple Thunderbolt dongle on the debugger machine too, and it seemed to work well. On the other hand, windbg on a MacBook retina display was not so good, as it didn?t seem to know how to scale to the high DPI display very well. The modern MacBook Pros are one of the few modern laptops that can run WIndows and support 1394, although Apple was silly to not put a TPM chip in them, so BitLocker disk encryption doesn?t work optimally (you can manually configure a boot password, which one could argue is less secure than a large random password stored in the TPM, although one could argue is more secure because you can?t boot at all without the password).
Jan
On Sep 30, 2014, at 12:48 PM, Don Burn wrote:
> Well except for serial (and finding systems with legacy serial ports is a challenge these days), I haven’t found anything more reliable. I and my clients have no interest in hypervisors, and multiple VM’s so the choices get limited quickly, especially when you need to support Win7 and onward.
>
>
> Don Burn
> Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Website: http://www.windrvr.com
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Mark Roddy
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2014 3:37 PM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: [ntdev] Recomended PCIe 1394 cards for debugging
>
> I gave up completely on 1394 debugging. As far as I am concerned if it works it is luck and likely won’t work in the near future. I can’t handle debug interfaces that are utterly fragile. I change set ups too much.
>
> Mark Roddy
>
> On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Don Burn wrote:
>
>
> I put this out on the Windbg list, but in hopes of a quicker response I am
> posting here also:
>
> I have a client setting up a debug environment, and am wondering what people
> are using for 1394 PCIe cards. Especially could use advice with the OSR
> Store being out of stock on the one they carry.
>
>
> Don Burn
> Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Website: http://www.windrvr.com
>
>
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev
>
> OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
>
>
> — NTDEV is sponsored by OSR Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit: http://www.osr.com/seminars To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev
>
> OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
We’re evaluating new cards for the store, specifically looking for something
that is cheap, stable, and ideally supports the PhysicalUpperBound register.
Everyone should be able to benefit from this once we’ve done some testing,
but that unfortunately doesn’t help any immediate need.
-scott
OSR
@OSRDrivers
“Jan Bottorff” wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev…
Hi Don,
I HIGHLY recommend 1394 debugging with LSI FW643 chipset based cards. A big
factor is they support the optional high memory limit register, which allows
hardware based RDMA read/write above the 4GB line. This means memory read
performance is consistently fast on system with more than 4 GB of ram, They
also support 800 Mbps firewire, and are a native PCie chip, not a PCI to
PCIe bridge translation.
A year or two ago I talked about some specific card models over in the OSR
windbg list. I also now have a Startech LSI chipset based 1394 that fits in
a mini-pcie slot, which is useful on some systems. The Apple Thunderbolt to
1394 adapter (have not tried it as a target) also uses the LSI chipset,
which I assume would work in any Thunderbolt port.
I believe this card
http://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-Express-FireWire-Adapter-PEX1394B3/dp/B000WCT5HK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1412107902&sr=8-1&keywords=PEX1394B3
uses the LSI chipset and is available from Amazon or Staples. I have some
LSI chipset based cards from Unibrain that work awesomely.
For 800 mbps firewire you do need to get the correct 800 mbps cables, which
have a different connector.
Also note some cards are dual port, and you need to plug the cable into the
correct connector or else use the busparms options to specify which 1394
device to use.
The LSI FW643 Unibrain cards were VERY stable and fast for kernel debugging.
I used the Apple Thunderbolt dongle on the debugger machine too, and it
seemed to work well. On the other hand, windbg on a MacBook retina display
was not so good, as it didn’t seem to know how to scale to the high DPI
display very well. The modern MacBook Pros are one of the few modern laptops
that can run WIndows and support 1394, although Apple was silly to not put a
TPM chip in them, so BitLocker disk encryption doesn’t work optimally (you
can manually configure a boot password, which one could argue is less secure
than a large random password stored in the TPM, although one could argue is
more secure because you can’t boot at all without the password).
Jan
On Sep 30, 2014, at 12:48 PM, Don Burn wrote:
> Well except for serial (and finding systems with legacy serial ports is a
> challenge these days), I haven’t found anything more reliable. I and my
> clients have no interest in hypervisors, and multiple VM’s so the choices
> get limited quickly, especially when you need to support Win7 and onward.
>
>
> Don Burn
> Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Website: http://www.windrvr.com
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
> [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Mark Roddy
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2014 3:37 PM
> To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
> Subject: Re: [ntdev] Recomended PCIe 1394 cards for debugging
>
> I gave up completely on 1394 debugging. As far as I am concerned if it
> works it is luck and likely won’t work in the near future. I can’t handle
> debug interfaces that are utterly fragile. I change set ups too much.
>
> Mark Roddy
>
> On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Don Burn wrote:
>
>
> I put this out on the Windbg list, but in hopes of a quicker response I am
> posting here also:
>
> I have a client setting up a debug environment, and am wondering what
> people
> are using for 1394 PCIe cards. Especially could use advice with the OSR
> Store being out of stock on the one they carry.
>
>
> Don Burn
> Windows Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Website: http://www.windrvr.com
>
>
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev
>
> OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
>
>
> — NTDEV is sponsored by OSR Visit the list at:
> http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev OSR is HIRING!! See
> http://www.osr.com/careers For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and
> other seminars visit: http://www.osr.com/seminars To unsubscribe, visit
> the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
>
>
> —
> NTDEV is sponsored by OSR
>
> Visit the list at: http://www.osronline.com/showlists.cfm?list=ntdev
>
> OSR is HIRING!! See http://www.osr.com/careers
>
> For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
> http://www.osr.com/seminars
>
> To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at
> http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer