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Get the unallocated memory on 32-bit Windows, 4GB sys

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Comments

  • Gary_Little-3Gary_Little-3 Member Posts: 1,208
    " Management knows what customers are willing to pay for. This is their job.
    Developer's job is to do what management wants, and do it well enough "

    BULLSHIT! Pure unmitigated bovine fecal matter. All knowing management
    cannot find their ass, half the time, if their head was shoved up their
    asshole. Ever heard of the Edsel? Delorean? Apollo 1? All management fuck
    ups. Mny would throw Vista into that pile and I am sure there is a LINUX
    release that is more embrrassment than useful. Management is interested in
    time to market and reducing overhead to maximize profits. I'll lay you odds
    that Toyota's grief will go back to a MANAGEMENT decision shaving a corner,
    cutting a penny, some place to save millions.

    Using the memory above that usable by a 32 bit operating is simply dumb, and
    I can believe a MANAGEMENT idea.

    The personal opinion of
    Gary G. Little


    -----Original Message-----
    From: xxxxx@lists.osr.com
    [mailto:xxxxx@lists.osr.com] On Behalf Of Pavel A.
    Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:43 PM
    To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List
    Subject: Re:[ntdev] Get the unallocated memory on 32-bit Windows, 4GB sys

    By which book, please tell me? By the WDK documentation?
    It is not complete and totally correct, as everyone who ever tried something
    not trivial might learn.

    There are certain well known don'ts like hooking.
    But sometimes we have to rely on results of our own research, that are not
    documented at all - not as do's neither as don'ts.
    It is in a gray area, risky. There are certain known means to contain the
    risk
    and make it acceptable.
    DebugView is a small example of something not readily taken from a book -
    it was delivered to users first, and book writers explained it later.
    Same with CD & DVD recording software, same with P2P networking,
    same with NTFS hacks (Partition Magic, Ghost), VMware, and many many others.

    Management knows what customers are willing to pay for. This is their job.
    Developer's job is to do what management wants, and do it well enough :)

    Regards,
    --pa

    "Aram Havarneanu" <xxxxx@mgk.ro> wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev...
    > On Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 12:04 AM, Pavel A. <xxxxx@fastmail.fm> wrote:
    >> "Alexander Grigoriev" <xxxxx@broadcom.com> wrote in message
    >> news:xxxxx@ntdev...
    >>>
    >>> Any product that uses undocumented things should be avoided at all
    >>> costs.
    >>
    >> Ts ts. A nice phrase, but.... are you ready to part with DebugView?
    >> Quite a lot undocumented things eventually became documented - see
    >> winternl.h.
    >> Yet other things still are not documented completely and accurately, so
    >> people dig and hack and manage to create interesting products anyway.
    >> These days, it's hard to make money without taking risks.
    >> And trust the management, they know better :)
    >
    > DebugView is not production ready kernel mode software for
    > heterogeneous and generic environment. I think that for debugging and
    > for learning stuff it is perfectly acceptable to use undocumented
    > features, write drivers in ASM, hook the kernel etc.
    >
    > When it comes to delivering software to users, you must play by the
    > book in the most strict sense.
    >
    > --
    > Aram H?fv?frneanu



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    __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature
    database 4961 (20100320) __________

    The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

    http://www.eset.com
  • Maxim_S._ShatskihMaxim_S._Shatskih Member Posts: 10,396
    > Same with CD & DVD recording software

    No need in doing anything "gray" there, just use the MMC spec and IOCTL_SCSI_PASS_THROUGH.

    --
    Maxim S. Shatskih
    Windows DDK MVP
    xxxxx@storagecraft.com
    http://www.storagecraft.com
  • Maxim_S._ShatskihMaxim_S._Shatskih Member Posts: 10,396
    > Ironically you have just presented a key argument against use of "unconventional" stuff - if driver X

    Well, if the OP really considers the today's market of 32bit OSes with >3GB RAM to be great, and really considers major user's benefits (in terms of performance) by using these 800M or so of RAM, then he is oriented towards very specific customers.

    These customers will probably be happy with this product _by discovering all its corner egdes_, interop issues and so on, they will reboot without the conflicting product and so on.

    In the times of MS-DOS, all computer use was such, and people did use the computers nevertheless.

    But note a) it is unlikely that the product will survive on user's machine _if it sole benefit is a minor perf increase_ and the drawback is - crashing the system sometimes. Also note b) modern days Windows is much more stable then MS-DOS, and people often do value this stability, so, the target audience moves to overclocking teenagers or such. I don't think any corporate desktops will use such a product, for instance.

    --
    Maxim S. Shatskih
    Windows DDK MVP
    xxxxx@storagecraft.com
    http://www.storagecraft.com
  • Bob_KroeterBob_Kroeter Member Posts: 65
    In device manager one can view allocated memory ranges. Might there be a mechanism here to claim / check if the memory range is being used by another driver?
  • Doron_HolanDoron_Holan Member - All Emails Posts: 10,379
    Nope. Those are pnp arbitrated ranges (and they are not really memory allocated out of pool). If pnp could hand out the range you want to use, why woulf the os not use it?

    d

    tiny phone keyboard + fat thumbs = you do the muth



    -----Original Message-----
    From: xxxxx@gmail.com <xxxxx@gmail.com>
    Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:07 PM
    To: Windows System Software Devs Interest List <xxxxx@lists.osr.com>
    Subject: RE:[ntdev] Get the unallocated memory on 32-bit Windows, 4GB sys


    In device manager one can view allocated memory ranges. Might there be a mechanism here to claim / check if the memory range is being used by another driver?


    ---
    NTDEV is sponsored by OSR

    For our schedule of WDF, WDM, debugging and other seminars visit:
    http://www.osr.com/seminars

    To unsubscribe, visit the List Server section of OSR Online at http://www.osronline.com/page.cfm?name=ListServer
  • Maxim_S._ShatskihMaxim_S._Shatskih Member Posts: 10,396
    Well, MN_FILTER_RESOURCE_REQUIREMENTS can help.

    --
    Maxim S. Shatskih
    Windows DDK MVP
    xxxxx@storagecraft.com
    http://www.storagecraft.com

    <xxxxx@gmail.com> wrote in message news:xxxxx@ntdev...
    > In device manager one can view allocated memory ranges. Might there be a mechanism here to claim / check if the memory range is being used by another driver?
    >
    >
  • Maxim_S._ShatskihMaxim_S._Shatskih Member Posts: 10,396
    >Nope. Those are pnp arbitrated ranges (and they are not really memory allocated out of pool). If pnp
    >could hand out the range you want to use, why woulf the os not use it?

    Why not? Imagine the device's onboard memory described by the BAR, it is not RAM and is not visible to MM's physical page management, but PnP can trivially deal with it.

    --
    Maxim S. Shatskih
    Windows DDK MVP
    xxxxx@storagecraft.com
    http://www.storagecraft.com
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